I Got Five On It ~ Part One

This episode discusses the art of fair partnership, reciprocity, and negotiation between siblings and the impact that understanding reciprocity has on future relationships. Reciprocity and fair partnership are valuable and foundational for healthy adult relationships and building a healthy future. Join in on the laughter and inspiration with the Savage Siblings as they discuss the pros and cons of reciprocity and how that is connected to the spirit of negotiation. The episode asks, what do we both bring to the table of our relationships, business partnerships and human interactions? Learn the difference between healthy reciprocity and transactional relationships and get better to reach agreement and harmony through the value of reciprocity.  

Memorable quotes:

• Reciprocity is about siblings feeling appreciated for their role and respected for their skill. ~ Andre
• When you understand what you bring to the table,  you have reciprocity and value each other. ~ Andre
• If we share, we all become better and bless the future generation.  ~ Andre
• Your gift is only a gift when you give it for others to be better. ~ Andre
• Flow of energy or effort and understanding that it has to be in both directions. ~ Anitra
• In reciprocity, the other person should feel the value and/or love, I give, we give, you give. ~ Anitra
• Core of reciprocity you have to learn both sides of the relationship. ~ Anitra
• Reciprocity for givers sometimes is difficult and for receivers, giving may be difficult. ~ Anitra
• In reciprocity, you must learn how to stop giving away free samples, and realize what you have is valuable. ~ Andre
• Trust your judgment on who you bring to the table so you aren’t manipulated. ~ Andre
• Don’t let everybody come to the table! You are about to eat on when it comes to reciprocity. ~ Andre
• Cultivate the table so you don’t depend on impulse, ask critical questions before you invite others to the table. ~ Andre

Keywords: 

#MentalHealth, #therapy,  #psychotherapy, #relationships, #psychology, #healing, #counseling, #ministry, #theology, #transformation, #change, #counselor, #therapist, #wholeness, #healthy, #health, #lifestyle, #mental, #emotions, #emotional, #spiritual, #minister, #christianliving, #christian, #wellness, #lifecoach, #forgiveness, #SavageSibling, #Savage, #Sibling,  #Brother, #Sister, #Family, #Parent, #S2Mediaworks, #SavageSiblingsPodcast, #Negotiation, #Fairpartnership, #Reciprocity, #Comingtothetable, # Knowthetable, #Reliability, #Harmonyoverbalance, #Transactional/antireciprocity, #ParasitenotReciprocity,  #Sacrifice, #Takermentality,

Call to Action: 

• Post comments! Leave us a review!
• Share your thoughts on how you define reciprocity.  Have you developed excellent negotiation skills from your siblings?
• Any topics you want us to discuss?

Sound Editors: Kyle Davis and Dwayne McClendon
Music: Maxwell Music
Photography: K.Cross Photography

Brutally Honest. Relentlessly Transparent. Unapologetically Authentic.

Transcript

Anitra: 0:00

<silence> Hey, hey, beautiful people. How are we doing? I am Anitra n Lawson storyteller, producer, educator, content creator. He is Dr. Andre Evans,

Andre: 0:23

What's going on? Savage Siblings.

Anitra: 0:27

He is a pastor, a father theologian, author, writer, content creator, brother. That's still, I don't want even after all these years. And we are the Savage siblings, and this is the Savage Sibling Podcast where we are brutally honest, relentlessly transparent, and unapologetically authentic. Thank you for joining us for another episode, bro. Bro , check in with you. How you doing?

Andre: 0:53

I'm doing well. Can't complain. Can't complain at all . I , um, had a chance to hang out with some of my, my leadership team, executive team, and, and whenever we hang out , uh, as, as connected and apropos for this particular episode where we hang out, somebody's always busting out the cards. And so , uh, we find ourselves oftentimes in competition, but playing bid whiz , you ever wanna see church folks show their true colors and their need for Jesus? Go to a card table, <laugh> , but , um, a hundred percent <laugh> . But , um, um, it's , it's so funny. As I was kind of researching and preparing for this particular episode, I realized how important it is to make sure, especially in card games, and our game is bid whizz . That's an old folk game for you , young siblings, right ? Listening

Anitra: 1:39

To this

Andre: 1:40

<laugh> , um, how important it is to have the right partner for the game. Mm . Good . Like if you , that's , if the , if you don't have the right partner bringing the right cards to the table, you know, part teams will fight amongst each other, <laugh> , you know , know , just yelling at each other, right? So one of the things I, I love about Wi Bid wisdom in particular is the fact that sometimes I can carry the whole hand by myself, and I don't necessarily need my partner to bring anything. But what I also realize is in that though, my partner is still everything. Meaning, like, even if you don't bring any cards to the table, I should be able to have the same vibe with you. Like, you know, you know, if I'm, if I'm playing a Trump card, don't you play the Trump card trying to beat my card? Like, let me win <laugh> . Like, but every now and then I get this new dude on the table, and that's what I was stuck with. That's the worst thing at a card party, is to get stuck with a partner you've never played with before . Not even sure if they know how to play. And I'm telling you, I almost quit midway. And if it had that been for someone like tapping me, talking about , don't forget what you do on Sunday, I'd have walked off the table. This absolutely don't off the table, right? That's what I feel. I feel like, listen, this ain't got nothing to do with a collar I wear on Sunday. This real life. It's real life, you know? Uh , but yeah, so, so it , it just really put me in a mindset of how valuable it is to have someone who's in , in sync with you, vibing with you when you trying to win at this thing, whether it's cards or win at life, it's always good to have somebody rocking with you who's on the same wavelength and just bring stump to the table that, that, that you can use. So both of y'all can , can have victory. So that, that, that was , uh, that was on my mind as we were playing, or this, this episode rather, was on my mind as we were playing. And , and again, it's just, yeah, it's just good , good blows to have somebody, you're right. Well, it can, and that's what I'm saying, just in life, it's just good to have somebody that's like, that's on the same wavelength as you just , y'all can look at each other and just, and a whole dissertation could be said and just one look. 'cause you just, you just know what each other's thinking about. Mm-hmm . What each other's bringing to the table. Let's go on and , and , and get this money. Let's go and get this bread <laugh> . Let's go on and get this victory. It's , it's just good to have somebody like that in your corner at the table with you. So, yeah. That , that's , that's what my realization was after that moment that's been carrying me all week. So I'm love it . But anyways, that's me. What's been good with you?

Anitra: 4:11

You know, it's funny , um, this week is , it's been about striving and , uh, and I just kept thinking about how you have to push through and strive and , uh, you know, when I was growing up, middle school, high school, I ran track, but I was never fast. I , I just had, you know, okay , I could do long distance. In essence, I had stamina. So I would always run like the 800, the mile. And , uh, there used to be this medley race where you had like , uh, two, 200 runners, and then you had a 400 runner, and then you had, right , the 800 that would round it out. I remember that . I would do that, and it was, it was a good race because I had strong people starting. So I just had to maintain, you know, <laugh>, wherever we got when it got to meet . Just , just maintain, don't the edge , you just don't

Andre: 4:53

Lose it. You just don't lose.

Anitra: 4:54

Right? Just don't lose the edge. Now , it didn't matter if we were last, just keep last, you know, <laugh> , right ?

Andre: 4:59

Just keep last.

Anitra: 5:00

And we were first. You better keep that first. Don't get to second, you know? And so I remember loving that space where it was just like, just, just maintain this. And then pretty soon I got moved to where I just ran long distance and I started to miss that ability to pass it off to somebody or hand it off. I was like, man, it's just me out here. Like, whew , ain't nobody to , we still run it . Ain't nobody to pass this too . Nope . It's just your competition around you. You better learn how to strive <laugh> . You better learn how to stick in it so you can't run too fast at the beginning. You can't run too slow at the end. You had to kind of Right , right . Hit that stride and hit that rhythm. And so that's, this week I've been looking like, where's my team? Stick? Right ? Stick ,

Andre: 5:40

Right . I'm with you <laugh> .

Anitra: 5:41

Like , I'm ready to pass it. This . Someone's like, Nope. It's just you in this race right now. So just keep pushing it . Doubt . No doubt. It's been good doubt . It's been good lessons. And God always lets me know he is there with me. So I am srid and striving in this season, and I'm, I'm happy for it. So no complaints. I love it .

Andre: 5:56

But , um, let's jump into this sound off segment.

Speaker 4: 5:59

Sound off segment. Sound

Andre: 6:03

Off . So this particular episode is entitled, I got five on it. I got five on it . And , um, the reason why we titled it I got five on it is because <laugh> , it's this, it's this, it's this thought process that as siblings, we, we learn something early on. And that's this kind of spirit of reciprocity, this, this understanding what you bring to the table, what I might bring to the table, what we bring to , to the table together, so that then we could get higher if well , or get or go higher. I got , I got five on it in my mind right now. <laugh> get higher, or we could go higher, pun intended , uh, whatever, whatever, whichever way y'all wanna roll with it is fine with me. No judgment here. No judgment here at all. <laugh> . But , but it really, you know, because you , you learn, what do you bring to the table? What you got that's gonna help us win what you got that's gonna bring us victory? And, and when I really thought about it as it relates to kind of this , this just sound off to , uh, of , of , of this particular episode mm-hmm . <affirmative> is we really do learn reciprocity as siblings, but we first learned it as negotiating. That's what we first learned it as. Like, siblings are naturally going into this negotiation process, right? Because you can't help yourself, right? You just, you , you , it's 'cause I know what I want outta life. I need my sister to help me. So let me go to negotiate her her part in all of this so that I can get to where I want to be. Right? And so it's in that negotiation process that we do learn some stuff and, you know, it wouldn't , you know, we learn what it is we actually can do that brings success to a team effort. Even if that team effort is like, I want this, I still gotta negotiate with my younger sister. I gotta know what she brings to the table. I gotta know what she can do really well so that, that we can do it in order to know what you bring to the table. Mm-hmm . You first learn to negotiate who you are and what you have, and you really do this in childhood. Um, a as siblings, I <laugh> , I just, I just, you know, as a sibling , uh, what I know what I want in life, and this is because of my history with you, Nikki . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I'm actually better prepared right now to be able to negotiate things in life because of what I went through growing up. No, I'm serious. So , so whether I , I , look , I'm full or prepared to negotiate a hostage standoff of some high stakes labor disputes because I , I know , listen, I'm , no , I'm dead serious. If the F b I called me right now, and I know my F B I agent is listening, if I'm called right now, <laugh> , I'm telling you, I know how to nego because I've had to negotiate now and later from Nicki Percent . I've had to negotiate <laugh> , right? I've had to negotiate, you know, her silence because of what I was fitting to get into

Anitra: 8:58

What he was doing . <laugh> .

Andre: 8:59

So, I , I , listen, listen, I'm telling you right now, I be , I've been watching too many of them movies. I'll tell you right now, c i a call me right now, <laugh> , I can get a terrorist out . He's equipped. <laugh> , I'm equipped. I'm fully ready. I am absolutely fully ready because I'll tell you , I , they were Nikki , Hey , you gotta learn how to keep your secret. If you go hang with me, <laugh> . Like I've said that to you. I've said that to you. And , and here's the thing about learning negotiations . I think what it's gonna

Anitra: 9:24

Cost you, <laugh> .

Andre: 9:26

See? And see, here's the thing. It went bo it went one of two ways. You either told me what it's gonna cost me or watch this. I had to learn Nikki's sins so I could leverage them against her. <laugh> . Listen, that's the art of negotiation. <laugh> . I like, listen, I'm about to do wrong. I know you are wrong. Let's go and get this. Let's , let's go be quiet for each other. Let's go . And those topate those negotiations,

Anitra: 9:53

I silently walk away <laugh> , right ?

Andre: 9:55

<laugh> . So either way, either way, that's what I, it's kind of how, how I learned it. Because when you think about negotiation, I'm gonna say this and I'm gonna throw it to you and then, then I'll come right back in a second. But when you think about negotiations, it really is, it's like this interaction between two points of view. Like, I want to do this. Nicki doesn't want to get in trouble, right ? But I want to find a little trouble to get into, let's meet halfway. Let's, let's, let's meet halfway <laugh> . So, so that, that's my, you know, that's our first step to learning what we bring to the table or the spirit of reciprocity is first the art of negotiation. So I'm, I'm gonna pause there and I wanna get your thoughts on, on negotiations.

Anitra: 10:36

Oh , I 100% co side , everything you just said. And I , as I was kind of unpacking this notion of reciprocity via siblings, it's like this ever, it's this never ending goal to get to, to air quotes fair partnership, right? Like that's kind of that foundational thing of fair partnership. But for those of you guys that had brother sisters like me, Andre was never fair in the partnership <laugh> , he would say,

Andre: 10:59

Fair is subjective. Fair is subjective.

Anitra: 11:02

No , no . Saying , I'm gonna break it down. He would say, yeah, it's a partnership. Yeah, we're gonna have some harmony. Listen, shout out to all the younger siblings, if you remember them times when your parents would leave the house. And obviously unfortunately the oldest eldest sibling was left. What in charge? And I remember standing looking at the door as mom or dad would leave <laugh> and I'd be blinking my eyes furiously trying to sit blinking twice .

Andre: 11:30

If you're everybody

Anitra: 11:31

Else , don't leave me here . <laugh> , he beats me when you're gone . Right? He's going to do these things, right? But, so even when parents first kind of try to establish that reciprocity, that fair partnership among siblings, 'cause they want their children to understand sharing, et cetera , right ? Once they're gone, that's all out the window. Now all out the window. Everybody is fighting for their version as, as Andre Burwell . You just kind of presented that, that negotiation. So when mom and dad are home, the TV remote is fair game, right? That means Dre gets to watch he-man and then Nikki gets to watch my Little Pony Still discussions right about that. You're gonna rotate none whatsoever . It's gonna a balance, right? Same thing with video games, right? Even if Nikki loses, she gets to stay on the couch and after you play, then she gets to play. But as soon as your parents

Andre: 12:21

Are gone, yeah , I remember that. <laugh> ,

Anitra: 12:22

The TV remote is no longer fair game. Now it's marathon of he-man and GI Joe and all the shows and Nickelodeon that I don't wanna watch, right? Like the stuff that I wanna watch, there's no negotiation 'cause he's the older brother. So now you gotta go find someplace else to do that. So yes. Then you start saying, okay, well how can I leverage this? Right? So now you're thinking about, okay, well when that girl calls next time and I answer

Andre: 12:48

<laugh>,

Anitra: 12:48

I'm gonna see , I'm gonna see if I think about if you're really home right? When call waiting is in full effect, maybe I won't click over, maybe I'll just won't keep

Andre: 12:56

Having my conversation. Right ?

Anitra: 12:59

And you start to learn as Ro mentioned, how to leverage those two things to make sure that there's some level of it. But I do think our parents really do train us to, to learn reciprocity amongst siblings really well. Well they try to,

Andre: 13:13

Right? They try to .

Anitra: 13:14

It doesn't always work, but I definitely, you know, when they're around, their mindset is you share, you balance, there's some harmony to it, right ? Right . Take time . But then I think as you get , uh, a little bit savvier in it, you know, then you learn how to use it in a way that benefits the both of you. So like when it's Saturday cho day .

Andre: 13:30

Sure .

Anitra: 13:30

Absolutely. You know, I remember Dre would be like, well you're better at cleaning the bird cage out than I am. And I used to enjoy that. So you do that and then I'll do this over here. 'cause we gotta get it done before the end of the day. So mom's not tripping. And so you start to find ways to say, well, let me take on this. I clean this better or I do this better, right ? And let's get it done. 'cause at the end of the day, we wanna have the rest of our Saturday to ourselves. And so you start to kind of find that fair partnership as you get older. But definitely siblings yeah . Will definitely teach you what they bring to the table. Definitely teach you how to be aggressive to get what you want. And then you do start to pay attention to their needs. And I'll say this last thing can get back to you. Even when you're younger, you, you sort of naturally kind of care, you know about your siblings and, and mm-hmm . <affirmative> , are they gonna get some of what I'm getting? And I remember getting gifts or getting things when I was young and I'd be like, well, what about Andre? Does he get one of these two mm-hmm . <affirmative> mm-hmm . Can he have some of this? And it does change as you get older than you're like, you get nothing. But when you're young, there's a sweet spot there and you try to share it. And so I think it's, it's the complex learning experience with siblings that helps us understand reciprocity, the good, the bad, the ugly. So let me kick it back to you.

Andre: 14:32

Right? Right. No, no. There's, there is that growth process and it does spill over into adulthood. And it's so funny that you mentioned that there is still this portion of care, because even while I'm the one defining what fair is when you're young, I still needed to make sure that something in my heart still wanted to make sure that you got something out of it. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And so then as you got older and we both started redefining what fair is because it's, it's not cookie cutter for every set of siblings. Right. It all , but that's great because it's not only cookie cutter for every set of siblings , it's not even cookie cutter every single time in one particular set of siblings. And that's the, that's the importance of learning this kind of spirit of reciprocity. Because then as you get into an adulthood, not every moment of reciprocity is the same. And we can't approach it, the sames. And as we really unpack this topic, we're gonna see the detriment of, of, of oversharing. The detriment of being the giver Too much, the detriment of being the taker too much. Right? Yeah . Yeah . Because absolutely reciprocity works because from at a young age, we're taught the negotiation, the art of returning favors. Yeah . And to , and , and , and we , we learn how to return favors. Then what happens is, is we avoid the social stigma as an adult of being this ingrate or always being a taker. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> or always living in a vacuum or being isolative. Right . And it really does end up being this sibling thing that is taught because our parents, they taught us in theory what it means to share. Right. That's good . In theory. That's good theory . What it means to, to , to , to give what it means to take turns. They taught us in theory. Mm-hmm . Because I can't say to my , uh, I can't teach from child to parent. There's certain things I can't teach in the art of negotiation. Reciprocity. 'cause a parent can say, no, no, no, this is the way it's going to be. And that's it. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Right . But as a parent, you know, talk , you know, speaking with children who are siblings, I can say, no, y'all need to learn to share. Right. You need to learn. That's right . That's good. And , and so that , yeah. Those negotiation processes definitely find their way into adulthood. And , and , and it's , you know, you know , I'm , I'm not still trying to forge a compromise over the v h s you know, trying to watch , you know , right. For young people. Google v h s I know you don't know what that is. And I , and I'm also not necessarily trying to negotiate the world peace accords, but they're just kind of regular, everyday human being. Things that reciprocity can show the benefit to. Uh , and using those same skills I did , uh, when I was young, but also the same skills as world leaders use today to solve world related problems. Right . Hundred and the best of all thing there is that , uh, we , uh, as we kind of get better at reaching agreement in a , in a painless manner, <laugh> , it's because of how well we were able to learn to negotiate , uh, in this, in this sibling relationship. The fact of the matter is, I definitely perfected my negotiation skills because of you Nikki <laugh> . And , you know , and you know, you know, the first thing you said is, is , well, let me tell you what it's gonna cost you. But that's very true. I distinctively remember <laugh> times, I used to sneak out of church at Grant Chapel AME in Wichita, shout out to Dove K and Grant Chapel ame Right . Where me and my boys, Chris and Kaylin resting priest, Chris would sneak out of church. And, and you would know. And I literally would have to say to myself, how many now and later is this gonna cost me? Yeah . <laugh> . And so I used to have to say to you, Nikki , I'm gonna bring you some now and later back from the corner store. Like, I'm , I'm spending my tithe at the corner store <laugh>, because I'm supposed to give it at church, but I'm finna go to the corner store and I'm finna get me some noun later . And I knew, and here's what's crazy. I knew at a young age, Nikki , two to three, now laters would get you to keep your mouth shut. <laugh> . And here's the reason why. It wasn't because you had a massive sweet tooth. It was because I knew for a fact that mom didn't have any now and later. Right . So now the question is <laugh> , which one, what is the , um, the value that I bring to the table that keeps Nikki silence ? One might not be enough, two might not be enough <laugh> , but three was always enough. And I it was always enough. And so it was , so that was the , the so, so what did that mean? That meant I knew Nikki , I knew what her needs were. That's what we're talking about. When you got that spirit of reciprocity, you're simply saying, I know what my needs are, but I also know what the needs are of the person I want to go to victory with. I wanna win this battle with, I want get this paper, this bread with I know their needs. And, and what do we both bring to the table? 'cause I can't be the only one. And I also can't get to the point where her giving is obligatory. She feels obliged. No , I gotta make sure that in the spirit of reciprocity, we're both bringing where we're gifted at and we, we want to bring, we want to bring in . So we definitely learn what we bring to the table as far as giftedness, our hustle, whatever it is. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , we , we , we learn it. We absolutely , uh, learn that there, when I was thinking about it a little bit further, if we can go just a little bit further Sure . Before we get into the sponsorship , um, eventually what we learn is that we cannot be selfish in negotiation. Right. I started that way because I was the older sibling. It was easy to start that way. Probably near impossible for you to start that way. And I'd love for you to tap in on that in just a second. But it was easy for me to start off selfish. Whereas I believe you probably had to start off selfless. 'cause you didn't even know what, you didn't even know you were in a negotiation. Like you didn't know <laugh> , you didn't even know what you were getting into. Right. All you heard was candy. What about candy? Right . Candy. Candy. That's candy. Because that's what I started with. I got now later . I got now later . And it was like, oh yeah, I'd like a now later . Okay, this is what you gotta do. You didn't even know what you were getting into . So , so , so we start off self . Right, right. As you're already , you've already incriminated yourself. You didn't even know it . Like you got evidence on the fruit of your lips, literally. Right . <laugh> so and so, you know, but eventually we, we learn that it , it cannot be a selfish thing. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> as we get adults. It might try to be, but selfishness won't make its way into adulthood reciprocity that way. Because as an adult, we can tell now you just in this for yourself. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , you just, you just, you just in this for what you want, but you ain't not, you're not trying to make sure that I have a need met. And so, so we learned that as well. Uh , growing up. There's just this kind of principled negotiation <laugh> . And it becomes strategic in its effort , uh, where we're saying, you know, no, no, no. That this is that heart you were talking about earlier. No, no, no. Yeah . Nicky gotta eat too. Now I got , I'm going to eat. Nikki gotta eat. We gotta eat together. 'cause if we don't, yeah . Then I end up having this kind of polarizing effect. And, and we then end up in these entrenched positions where you're like, nah , I'm not getting to give. And then Andre says, well, okay, well I'm not, I'm not getting to give. So then what did we, we , we we're not getting anywhere. We're not getting in an area where we're both exactly where at impasse. 'cause nobody's getting their interests or their needs , uh, uh, met. But I'm a , I'm , I'm, I'm curious as to , uh, you know, what you kind of learned as far as , uh, you know, what you kind of knew to bring to the table or giftedness mm-hmm . <affirmative> , hustle, whatever it means . Uh , I'm gonna kick it to you for a second then . We'll, and then , uh, I want to keep going a little bit deeper on this.

Anitra: 22:23

Absolutely. So, yeah, I definitely think there might be something said for the hierarchy or the , uh, the birth order. 'cause I think as a younger sibling Yeah. You come into it and you kind of, you know, mentioned it in terms of the importance of understanding both people in the relationship where reciprocity is concerned. There's a trust factor there too. Right. Absolutely. Which will probably unpack that a lot more in the savage segment. But, you know, I'm also looking to my big brother in a very trusting way. 'cause he's a safe haven. He's a safe place. Which is again, part of the negotiation and negotiation as we'll . It is , we will talk about more, doesn't have to be negative. It can be, it can be, you know, positive. There's, there's layers to it as we're, you know, kind of unpacking. And so you're , you're trying to come into this space when it's an older sibling with just full on trusting. And what you learn is yes, their unique identity, your unique identity, and what each of you bring to the table. So it's kind of become a staple for my brother and I, and this probably did happen when we were younger, but if there's ever a time that someone needs to kind of talk to our dad, it's always Andre mm-hmm. <affirmative> . And that goes back to what he brings to the table because he has the rapport with father. And so for years it's always been, you know, Buro , can you talk to dad about this? Or can you ask him about this? Right. Right. And then when it comes to like, dealing with mom, then that's kind of been my thing. And so , oh yeah. Over time ,

Andre: 23:40

<laugh> every single time, right .

Anitra: 23:42

Over time you learn who the, who your siblings are and who you are, and you start to really figure out, is this a space because of the strength of who they are, where I need to be more selfless. They need me to step up into this space because they know I'm better at it, or I need to , to kind of step back because they're better at it. Um, you start to really negotiate that selfless or self ishness based on who you are as siblings and what it's called for. And I do think just our natural innate love helps us to make, you know, the , the right decision. And I know I can always, you know, call on, on my brother to, to step up when things that he knows I'm not as strong at and vice versa. Like, even when we talk about this podcast, like, Dre will be clear, this's technical stuff you do that, I'm gonna stick to the creativity in terms of on air . And we break down our strengths mm-hmm . <affirmative> to make this come to life. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Yeah . Um , it makes me also think about like our Aunt Ola and think about in terms of the structure of her siblings. Like she is the sibling that brings the family together. It doesn't matter three years , I'm many . My my dad, uncle Wesley, everybody can talk about, you know, what they wanna do. But it's always gonna be on Ola that note that comes in and brings people together. And that's just one of the gifts and, and the , the tenets of her character that she's the one that will rally everyone together. And I think when you start to look at your own sibling structure, you start to see, you know, what each sibling brings to the table. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And there's just this really natural, you know, spirit of reciprocity that's, that's just kind threaded through that. And that's the beauty of having siblings is that Yeah. It's just like we , we gave the analogy of, of the , the track, you know , the relay team or the bid whiz players, you just get to where you kind of naturally understand how they flow. And sometimes you, you, you ha you become more selfless because you , you know that the greater good of whatever it is you're dealing with, that they need more of you or less of you. And so whatever that is, that's what you provide. If you need me to be a little bit more here or give a little bit more or take a little less, then I'm willing to do that because I understand who you are and you understand who I am. Right . And I understand what we're doing together. So it's definitely trust. And I definitely think definitely it's , um, a harmony of selflessness. Um, and then yeah, we can have that space of selfishness. But siblings chip away at that too. <laugh> on a general basis .

Andre: 25:57

They do. Absolutely. Absolutely. Because as we get older, you start to see that process differently. It's no longer just a spirit of reciprocity. It's actually the , uh, the spirit of relationship where both of us are going to win. And it's not based on any givens. 'cause like you said , um, aunt Ola ends up being this matriarch, but she's not the oldest and she's not the youngest. Right. It's just kinda where she is. Excellent point. Yeah . It's who she is in her giftedness. 'cause aunt, aunt Ty's older than Aunt Siola , if I remember correctly. And so , uh, and definitely Uncle Wesley's the oldest. Right. So, so it's not like ,

Anitra: 26:34

Yeah . Think Uncle Wesley, then Aunt Ola , then

Andre: 26:36

They're Aunta. Okay. Okay. Yeah. They're

Anitra: 26:37

Aunt many , then dad, then aunt me . Yeah.

Andre: 26:40

So , so you might naturally say to yourself, well, hey, well, uncle Wesley should be the one. Right ? No, no, no. Absolutely no. Right . <laugh> , that's, that's a whole nother episode. Absolutely. No, that's a whole nother episode. I love, I love you Uncle Wesley. Uncle Wesley , but absolutely no <laugh> . And he'd

Speaker 5: 26:55

Say that too. He'd be like, I'm not working . And he would say , right . I ain't leading his family. I may not even come <laugh> .

Andre: 27:01

Right, exactly. So, so, so, yeah. So it's not even about what's given or what's expected of you. It's, it really is where you're most gifted. And here's how that works relationally is , is everybody, you know, you mentioned the family dynamics of dad and, and his siblings, but everybody as a cornerstone , uh, of understanding reciprocity, everyone feels appreciated for who they are. Yes. Everyone feels affiliated for what they bring to the table. Everyone feels like equals everyone has the same status. Everyone feels respected and can stand on how they're gifted. Everyone understands their roles and their activities, and they are fulfilled when everybody brings their five to the table. Right. <laugh> . And so therefore, as long as they have all those things, there's no conflict. But as soon as you cross one of those needs, conflict is going to arise. Yeah . Um , you, if you, as soon as you cross off respect, conflict, as soon as you cross off appreciation, that feeling that you're appreciated conflict. Yeah . As soon as you, because you can't have compromise without all of those core things. Uh, when it comes to both negotiating and learning, the spirit of reciprocity. 'cause it's, it really is, at the end of the day, our spirit of relationship. It's a , it's a spirit of that's good relationship. And when you have all these things, all of them, and all these things really start to make sense. You're , you're equating how gifted you are, how hard you hustle. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , you know, your anointing, just the things that you're favored in doing, then watch this. And every watch, everybody that brings something to the table, all of us improve. Right. Ooh , people . That's good . People tell me all the time, Andre, you're a great listener. Well, where did I do, where did I learn that? Listening to Nikki ? No, I'm serious listening to Nikki because it helped me negotiate how , uh, what , what Nick , it helped me both negotiate and learn reciprocity. It helped me to learn what I bring to the table. 'cause I'm listening to what Nikki brings to the table. I'm listening to what Nikki needs. And then because I'm listening to her and I know what I need, so I'm listening to what she can do, and I know what I can do. It's a way of promoting both of us to where we need to be. And that's, that's why so much of our relationship is, Nikki , we going to do this. Not Nikki , I'm gonna do this. Can you help Nikki ? We going to do this? We're gonna do this. And I don't. I and , and , and , and here's what's crazy . Like, and , and think about this for a second. There's some subconscious level of reciprocity with us. I don't think it's by happenstance that you chose Tallahassee over New York. Nope . Nope . I also don't think it's by happenstance that I say, Hey, we Finn to move from Charlotte to Southern California when Nikki ended up in la mm-hmm . <affirmative> . That's good . None of those things are by happenstance. It because the negotiation, the reciprocity, it's a relationship process. And I think so many people as adults, they fail to be able to give , uh, and balance giving and taking. They fail to be able to be in a relationship or reciprocity. Either one, because they're an only child and they fail at a lot of things. But then number two, oh no <laugh> because , so tired <laugh> because , um, you didn't learn the negotiation process and you started seeing people as a stepping stone. Ooh . Wow. Yeah. And so , yeah. So when all I see is people as a stepping stone, negotiations will only take me one step. Ooh , I hope somebody heard that. If all I see people as is a stepping stone, I'm limited as to how far I can get in success. But when I see people as a relationship, then negotiations take a lifetime. They become, when I see people as a relationship or res reciprocity, now it's a lifelong move. 'cause the fact of the matter is, people will know if they were your, your stepping stone or if you or they were your life's success. Yeah . And if they feel like you stepped on them, so they feel they've been stepped on, they ain't necessarily going to be there the next time. You need another step. That part. Right. They're not going to be there. If you didn't find common ground to build a relationship, and all you found was a common step, well then that means your giftedness became , uh, a , a a signal to them that you're only there to eat by yourself. You're not there to make sure that if you eat, I eat right. So I don't ever feel, anytime I come to you and say, Nikki , I need help. Anytime you come to me and say, Andre, we let's do this. I never feel like I'm being stepped on. I always feel like this is a path towards both of our success. That's so good. And because I truly listen to you mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I now know that you're not saying something that's just a step. I know you're saying this is a pathway. This was huge, different. I'm not a step. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I'm a pathway. A pathway. And it's because I listened to you. I know, I know what you want to eat before the meal is prepared mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And so I'm already thinking to myself, well , let me think ahead of where we are. So that if Nikki says, Hey , uh, I need, I let's, we need to do this. I already know because I've studied and I know you and I know where you're wanting to go for both of us. And that way then, you know, I'm already, I'm already pre preparing because that's really what the spirit of reciprocity is. It's a preparation for a purpose that's taking you to , uh, an area where you couldn't , uh, get to , uh, without this person. Um, and, and, and so when I think of the spirit of reciprocity, when I think of being able to effectively develop a relationship and negotiation for someone, it, it really is about being prepared so that both of you can eat, both of you can get to where you're going. I , I've got an example to that, then I'm gonna kick it back to you. Uh, Sharonda was flying into town to come and visit mm-hmm. <affirmative> . And , uh, Sharonda is typically, Sharonda is a, and I know she's gonna hear this and call me immediately. She's a, she's a five Michelin star rated type of girl. What I mean by that is for the , those of you who don't know Michelin ratings, she don't go out to eat unless it's five star Michelin rated. Right . <laugh> . Right . She , she don't , she don't, she don't do fast food. She do restaurants with hor d'oeuvres. <laugh> . Like , you look at the menu and, and it , and it says hor d'oeuvres and <laugh> , you know, for the rest of us try to figure out what is , or DeVare , no , hor Dres <laugh> . Right ? So, so she don't do, she don't do anything less than Michelin star. She's a Michelin star rated girl. And bless her, God has blessed her. She's got the ability to do that. Right. <laugh> . So I love it . But , but , but, but the way me and my bank account work , <laugh> the way my money work , <laugh> , I'm more of a grocery star dude. Right . <laugh> . I'm more of a , so , so , so when I knew she was coming, I had to think to myself like Uhoh . Right ? Um , <laugh> , you know, I'm thinking to myself, oh boy, we, we , we gonna have to go to, we gonna have to go to this . Like, we have restaurants here in San Diego. They're not named after whatever the title is on the front. They're named after the Chef <laugh> . Right . Who brings the menu . Good . So I'm thinking to myself, oh Lord, we gonna have to go to Chef's restaurant or the bank Chef du mall , you know, down the gas lamp . Like, I'm thinking to myself. And so I immediately was like, mm-hmm . Like my bank account, like this is going to be detrimental to my bank account. <laugh> , right? So, so, so, so there are times where you got to negotiate out the spirit of relationship saying don't give more than what you got. Right? Yeah . Come on now , stick within your giftedness. And so what I said to Sharonda was, is Listen baby, we could go to Chef Dumond , <laugh> , <crosstalk> , we can do that. I said, but baby, or what we can do is I, chef Andre can make something <laugh> in his small apar <laugh> and listen, and we can deepen our ion <laugh> , you know , right here in the house, <laugh> . Right, right, right, right . Exactly. Right here in the ca . You know , I was like, so like, and I'm , and I'm telling you, this is exactly how I'm talking <laugh> . I'm saying we could just, I'm gonna cook and , and now watch this. Now Michelin star rated restaurants automatically get her attention. Right . But what takes her to the next level of success in the relationship is we can deepen our ion if I cook. So she missed the whole, she missed the Michelin stars and heard Right . <laugh> the message, which is the deepen relion . So, so, so me, but watch said so, so there , so the negotiation there is, is simply me saying, all right , we can go to this place and the menu's prepared, or I can tap in what I know about you and I can make the menu created to what I knew about you. We come on, somebody better hear what I'm just saying. That Yeah . That's goods , that's that spirit of reciprocity. I'm, I'm, listen, I know what I bring to the table and what and when I want both of us to eat. I'm creating a menu based on what I know about you. That way that you gonna bring to the table your best as well. You gonna bring to the table and appeal that, that , that makes me feel like I don't want in life as well . Mm-hmm . And , and , and it's that type of thing that helps people just continue life long reciprocity with you. If all, again, if all I see you as a stepping stone, then you ain't gonna continue with me. But when I can say, this is what I bring to the table, and it's not just for me, it's for us. It's for us to get better. That's the key. Yeah. It's for us to go deeper. It's for us to get to get better. Those are life long reciprocal relationships that we need to be building. And not the selfish stepping stone relationships. I, I, you know, that's how negotiations work . That's how reciprocity where I tell people all the time , uh, when I used to teach at , uh, at a , uh, the Christian college here locally, I would get these students coming to my class and, and they'd be like, Dr. Evans, I, I , I enrolled to take your class. And I was like, well, why did you enroll to take my class ? Uh , be be because I, I heard what you bring to the course. I heard what you bring. That's good . That's good To the course. That's good . And I can't get what you bring to the course anywhere else. So that becomes my appeal. And so then I give them what they heard and they grow and they become better. And now some of them still come back to me today. Hey , uh, uh, professor Evans, anything I can do for your church? Yes. Yeah , yeah . You can join us in this ministry and help us out. 'cause I need , and that's, then they bring back to the table what I brought to help them grow. So they're bringing it back refined and even better. Those are those lifelong relationships that are built on someone simply saying, I got five on it. Let's both get high or go higher. Whichever one you want. <laugh> , go higher . Whichever one you want. And, and , and so don't miss the deeper lesson you learn when it comes to valuing a relationship of reciprocity. 'cause when you understand what you bring to the table, you stop <laugh> . I told this to, oh my gosh. One more example. I promise you . Last example, then I'm gonna kick it back to you before the sponsorship. Uh, what I was, I was talking to , uh, uh, Corey , 'cause she recently turned 18 mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And she's, and as one of the first things she wanted to do, turning 18, is she wanted to go buy some scratchers. And so we went, for those of you not from the Midwest, so scratchers are the lottery tickets where you scratch off, you know mm-hmm . <affirmative> different , you know, to see if you want. So she wanted to go buy scratchers. And, and, and so she bought some scratchers. And two of the scratchers hit one was for $5, one was for an extra ticket. And so I said, all right , well let's, let's, you know, we'll go, we'll go take care of that after I pick you up from school. So we went, she got her $5 and, and she got her extra ticket. She scratched off the ticket, wanted an extra $5. And I was like, all right , well come on Corey . I see you . I see you . And so, you know, she , we went back and we got her $5 and she said, get me. And she said, hit me with another one of those tickets. And I said, Corey , you want to keep your money? She's like, no , dad, I'm gonna scratch off and I'm gonna win me about $50,000. And I was like, I know that's right girl. And I said , when you do win that $50,000, that's gonna pay for your whole college education. Right. <laugh> , like , so you make sure. And she's like, well, it'll pay for half of it. I said, what you mean what you going to do with the other? She said, watch this. Well , I'm gonna pay, I'm gonna give the other 20 . I'm gonna give half of it to Corrine towards her college education too. Mm-hmm . My , my my , and, and , and here's the thing. I know why Corey's saying that. Corey's saying that because Corey and Corrine have a life long reciprocal relationship where they've said, I'm going to school for this. I'm going to school for this. We're going to keep being a blessing to each other because watch this. When we re when we're ready, we're gonna open up our own business together. Yeah . Yeah . And so as long as I keep pouring into you now you keep pouring into me, we're gonna get there a lot faster. We're gonna get there a lot sooner than people, partnership . Expect partnership . So that partnership, that relationship, reciprocity for them starts now. I'm starts, starts now at a young age. Yeah . Yeah . You know, Corin sent Corey like $50 via Zelle on, on her , uh, birthday. And I'm saying to myself, Nikki ain't never sent me $50 <laugh> not for my birthday. That is now you done sent me $50 for other reasons , but not for my birthday. Birthday . <laugh> . Wait a minute. I'm lucky if I get a happy birthday. The text , right ? Maybe. And if it , and it might be on the 13th. Chances are it's on the 14th, on the 15th. Ooh . I forgot. Happy later . Or , or listen to early in case I forget. Lemme Oh , early, right ? In case I forget <laugh> , I might , but Nikki , it's May, it's not even September. But in case I forget,

Anitra: 41:39

I know . Just , I'm putting it on the

Andre: 41:40

Books now . <laugh> . Right ? Right now. <laugh> . But anyways , you know, it's just , it's that thing where Corinne and Cory have , have already said, no , we Finn to work on this. Because, because that's the deeper lesson. That's the value of establishing a reciprocal relationship. And I think many of us are missing that because we don't know how to effectively give so that we build a lifelong relationship. We give, because it's a stepping stone. I'm gonna give it to you now so you can get me where I want. But then I'm gonna forget about you as soon as I get where I'm going. No, I got five on it. 'cause we both getting high, we both going higher. Right . <laugh> , I got , I'm giving. 'cause we both are getting this. And, and, and that's, I think that's a huge thing that, that as adults we're missing today in a very selfish society, a very so society . Mm-hmm . Um , social atmosphere where it's, look at me, follow me like me, love me, see me. But what about us? Yeah . What happened to us? And , and , and that's the crazy thing about where we are. And I blame part of it. I blame social media. 'cause there's no longer this relationship interaction. It's just posts, <laugh> , that's all it is . Just posts, <laugh> . It's just a post. Like we we're not, we're not, we're not interacting the way , uh, that we should be socially. And so then we're, we're turning into this selfish society where, and and , and it's crazy 'cause we're even talking about siblings. Siblings , uh mm-hmm . <affirmative> . I I know a , I know a set of siblings right now, they don't even talk to each other. Don't even interact with each other except for on social media. That's not interacting . I mean , you , you , that's right . You talk to your brother. Oh yeah, I talked to him , uh, yeah . On social media is what they're referring to. That's rough. Yeah. Nah , you ain't interacted. And , and so there's no, there's, there's no growing together. There's never gonna be this moment. I shouldn't say never, but right now, there's not this moment where their gifts can help you. Your gifts can help them. And let's get, let , come on, let's get this bread. Let's get this paper together. I , we out here struggling in a vacuum. 'cause we don't know how to have a spirit of reciprocity or a relationship of , of reciprocity. I'm gonna kick it back to you now.

Anitra: 43:57

Absolutely. No , i, I co-sign everything you said. And so, speaking of spirit of reciprocity and what you bring to the table, we wanna shout out our sponsor for this episode, which is SS two MediaWorks, a media production company co-founded by my brother and I. And we bring to the table this notion of creating content that should educate, empower, inspire, hopefully encourage us all through positive, you know, living through positive giving back, and all of this told through original narratives. So our mission at S two Media Works is to provide transformational education and resources all leading towards healthy and productive , uh, lifestyles. And we love to do that through creative storytelling. We're dedicated to creating life-changing and life-giving content and all that we do. And this, the Savage Siblings podcast is a product of SS two MediaWorks lineup. We got so many other things in the canon , uh, from books to additional podcasts that we, we can't wait to release and share that with you. And so we're trying our best to, to , uh, use our gifts to bring things to the table to share with you all. And so, as always, thank you so much for joining us for another episode. And with that, bro , bro , we've already dug into, I feel like we already into the , the meat of the savage, but let's get in the savage segment. You ready to get savage?

Andre: 45:12

Absolutely. Let's, let's get Savage. So again, the name of the episode is, I've got five on it. I got

Anitra: 45:22

Five on

Andre: 45:23

It . And , and I think , uh, what we want to do is just kind of start with, is kind of maybe our definitions and perspectives individually as to what reciprocity is for the individual, right? Mm-hmm. <affirmative> , pretty much in nearly every culture, there is this process of socialization. And , and in that process of socialization, we, we have to be taught to share. And we know that when we, we all become better. When we share, we share knowledge, we share wisdom, we share technology, we share, you know, all of these things, science and math, if we share, we all become better. And we all have to also learn to take turns. <laugh> , right ? Yes . Right . You're strong here, so it's your turn. We all get a chance to show our giftedness when we do that. And we also have to learn in our socialization process to give back to everyone who gives to us. And that begins to bless the future generations. And we kind of keep the relationship going. And so people that just kind of don't learn this as, as a definition, don't learn this rule of reciprocity. Right ? I'm looking at you. Uh, only children, <laugh> people that don't learn this rule of reciprocity. They can only really try to get better. And here's the reason why I say that. Yeah. Until you learn the relationship that comes with being , uh, reciprocal, then you don't really understand that your gift is only a gift when you give it away for others to be better. What good is a gift if you don't give it for others to be better? Which means I need your gift. Yeah . Yeah . You need my gift. Yes. Our gifts are only as good as we give and receive from others, right? Because we're, what , what's the end game of socialization? What's the end game of a relationship, right ? Because at some point, those who you've given to, they're gonna come back and give to you and everybody's going higher. But those people you stepped on, you're gonna realize that that stone is no longer there and you can't get any higher. 'cause you have no more stones to step on. And so at the, at the core there, the reason why we give is is is because the relationship gets us better. We don't want to be ashamed or ostracized if we don't learn how to and kind of integrate this rule of reciprocity into our, our social behavior into who we are. So, so for me, the core definition of this relationship and reciprocity is, is I'm gifted. You're gifted. Let's give our gifts together mm-hmm. <affirmative> and let's get higher . So for me, that's kind of like, that's where I start when it comes to understanding reciprocity. I've got a gift, I got a gift , you got a gift, I need your gift. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , let's give together and let's get , and let's get a little higher. That, that for me is where I start in terms of definition. How about for you?

Anitra: 48:18

That's good. I love it. Um, I think about it as the flow of, of energy or flow of effort. Oh, that's good. And understanding that it has to be in both directions. And the reason why that flow of energy and effort must be both directions is because the goal is to make sure that the other person feels valued and or loved. Right? Like obviously in work environments or professional environments, it's more about the value, right? And then in relationships, it's the value and the love, right . Of how those can be interchangeable, right ? And so, yeah, I had something similar in terms of this, the art of I give you give we give, right ? And it really is all three of those. It cannot be one or the other. It has to be I'm giving, you're giving and we are giving. And when I was kind of processing this, it made me think about one of the core , uh, techniques in acting, specifically improvisation. That when you go to an improv class or you go to , um, you know, whether it's a community class or you're training it in school , uh, one of the first principles of of improvisation that they teach you is this principle called Yes. And okay. And it's the, it's the mindset of when I step into this space and we're gonna get some sort of concept that we have to basically jump into a free expression and I'm working with one other person or a whole group of people, you have to make up in your mind that one, you're going to say yes, yes. Means that's good, that's good. I'm going to receive whatever this, this my counterpart, my acting partner, right ? Uh , this team of actors across from me are going to give, so if they start a scene that's , uh, sensual in nature, and I, and I anitra , I'm uncomfortable with that. No, no, no. In improv, you say yes, that means you're gonna , you're gonna accept what they're presenting to you because you're gonna go on the journey. Got it . And then the follow part falling part to that is, and now I'm going to add something to it. So I don't just stand there and just receive , I love it. And just say, okay, I'll, I'll play , play along with everything love . I now have to give you something uniquely from my creative energy to add , add to the flow of the improvisation of the scene , the work that we're doing. And that's how we build these really amazing moments and improv. And so I think what the core of reciprocity has to teach us, just piggybacking off of that example, is you really do have to learn both sides of it. You do, you have to learn, giving and receiving. And for some of us, one side or the other might be easier <laugh> , right? Some people can receive all day. They just like, yep , this is good. Keep it coming. Right, right , right. And they have to work harder at learning to give, whereas other people are, it's easier to give, it just comes natural

Andre: 50:46

For you. Right . Just very natural.

Anitra: 50:47

A natural giver. Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . And then you can, you have to work at receiving. That's it . I remember our mom, and this happened years ago. She , um, it was at a time where I think I may have told this story before, but it was just life changing for me. 'cause it was teaching me understanding the way that she wanted to give. She loved to buy things for me. And this was before I was married and had kids mm-hmm. <affirmative> and I would be looking at all the stuff that she needed to buy for herself. Right,

Andre: 51:12

Right, right.

Anitra: 51:13

But it didn't matter that she needed to buy it for herself. Instead it was, oh, I wanna get this for Nikki . And I got it. Got to a point where I was really frustrated where I was just like, stop buying me things . Go buy this, go do this. And I remember our mom looking at me , Dre, and she had tears in her eyes. Mm . And she just basically said, why won't you let me, you know, give you these things. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Uh , because it's the way that I, in essence, express love. And I never knew that. But that's what , what it comes down to. Reciprocity sometimes for those of us that are natural givers , uh, which is what I am , uh, it's so easy for us to push back. Yeah. It's so easy for us to say, no, no, no, no. I don't need it. I'm good. You keep it, you keep it. 'cause I, we want to show love or show value, you know, in a way of giving. But in order to really get the importance of I got five on it, you can't be the only one paying for it all the

Andre: 51:59

Time. You cannot, you cannot,

Anitra: 52:00

Like people want to put five on it and you gotta let them put five on it. Right. Absolutely. And then Absolutely. You have to also contribute your five there too. And so I think when I was just simply breaking it down, it's, I give you give we give and then understanding. Yes. And in reciprocity . Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. I receive this and this is what I can and can bring. And I'm sure we'll unpack that a little bit more. But that's my foundational

Andre: 52:23

And, and you actually started going into how we learn reciprocity, because you do have to learn. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , it took me a while to learn to receive. Like, I have no problem giving. I , I , I , it was easy for me to learn to give within my means. So I, I , you know , I didn't, growing up the way we grew up, you know , we didn't have a million dollars. You learn real quick to give within your means because , you know, not only can I say I got five on it, but I also can say, I ain't got that. I ain't got it. I ain't got it. Right . I know how to say both. But what I had to learn is two things out of that. Number one, I had to learn the creativity of a , I may not have this, but I got this. And, and , and , and , and so it's not always about the money. Sometimes it's about the hustle. Sometimes that's why we mentioned that earlier. Yeah . Sometimes it's about just simply where you are gifted and anointed and, and when you figure that out, yeah. It becomes easy to give. But you also have to learn how to receive. So, so in learning, reciprocity is both sides. So I'm like you, Nick, I had to learn, and, and I'm gonna tell you the , the way I had to learn that I didn't learn it until I started pastoring. Oh . Because this is an area where pe and , and this is what's crazy, like mom, the pastor's mentality is, is no, I gotta take care of you. I gotta take care of you. I gotta take care of you. Well, how do I take care of you? Well, I got , I gotta give you the word. I've gotta teach, I've gotta make myself available to counsel , to pray. And I was doing that. And so that's what I was bringing to the table where I had to learn to receive is then folk were just saying, let me buy you dinner. Here's some money. And I kept saying , no, no, no, no. Don't worry about it . No , no, no. And, and, and it got to a point where old ladies was like, you blocking my blessing. And I was <laugh> that part . Don't do it . <laugh> . And , and , and when I tell you, when I tell you they were saying that they were dead serious. 'cause God told , they were like, you are right. You are stopping God from blessing me. Yeah . Yeah . And that was a tough lesson to learn. And so it didn't, and , and so what it has to translate into is as you're a giver, yeah. You gotta learn to receive. You , you don't learn to, you don't get it to the point where you become to be nothing but a taker. But you gotta learn how to balance giving and receiving if you really want people to grow , uh, in this process as well. Uh, because we, we listen, we, we have to , uh, uh, understand that part of people bring coming to the table and saying, I got this. I got this. It's 'cause they're trying to avoid being considered a freeloader or a parasite. Yes . Because you can't grow. And, and here's the thing I'm gonna say next. You also have to learn to stop giving away free samples. I , I wanna make sure somebody heard that <laugh>, that's gonna steam <laugh> , that's gonna Right. See when all you know how to do is give, you're becoming that person that gives away free samples. Mm-hmm . And we can you that person because you're not letting people give back. So you're just giving what, what's really valuable about you. Yeah. You're giving free samples, but it needs to be a give and take process. Yeah. And that way then if , because if you're not careful and you become known as the one always giving free samples, then you become the one easily manipulated. You become the one walked on. People be coming up with you as a salesperson talking about this is a good deal. All you need to do is no . You find yourself giving out a sense of obligation and giving out of sense of , uh, and you don't even know you're being used because you've given away free samples for so long. Listen, no . What you got, what you bring to the table has value. It is value adding and people need to give back valuable as well. They must bring value to the table as well. And I'm gonna say equal value, but I'm not, not talk , talking monetary. Right. Right. I might, you might, you might bring $5 to the table, but I know the $5 plug, right. <laugh> . Right . You know what I'm saying? So I'm still bringing something to the table. Um, you know, but, but it's, it's so I'm not talking money, but you gotta learn to let people bring equal value to the table. And you do that by learning to trust your judgment on who you going to partnership with, who you going in a relationship with. I trust Nikki explicitly meaning it wouldn't matter what you said you're bringing to the table. I already know it's worth millions. I'm going to trust the process. That's so good . And , and learning to trust our judgment. Uh, when it comes to distinguishing, you know, is someone bringing to the some table something that's, that's generous, that's genuine? Or are they bringing something that's designed to activate this obligatory giving from me? That part . We gotta learn that part. We have to. 'cause you know, people will, will bait you or, or shame you into giving people will guilt you into giving. People will, I've been guilted to bringing stuff to the table and I had to learn the hard way. And I learn , I had to learn. No , uh, like I had to learn. Nah , I ain't got it. Whole sentence . I , I had to learn. No matter of fact, matter of fact, right. No is a whole sentence <laugh> . And you know what, it's not only a whole sentence, it's, it's, no , it's, it's in nine , nine different languages. Like you nine . What I'm saying , like I , and , and that's the thing. And, and , and that's the thing. You gotta be okay learning that this relationship isn't reciprocal. So my answer's no, I'm not bringing anything to this table. I'm not going to do it because I'm no longer naive. I'm no longer overly trusting, but I'm also not overly mistrusting. I had to learn the relationship of reciprocity. And we all do. Yeah. A lot of the learning is just information, knowledge, understanding , uh, because I'm, I'm gonna give an example about, of , about learning and knowledge of, of yourself, know who mm-hmm . <affirmative> you are and what you're bringing to the table. That way then you don't miss out on opportunities and you don't get yourself a dead end opportunities. I'm bringing an example , uh, that, that , uh, that, that helps, that helps you understand what you gotta know about yourself. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> . Mm-hmm. <affirmative> , uh, I remember being in , uh, Charlotte just fresh out of college and I was renting this town home . And , uh, the town home was great. I, I enjoyed the town home , but the owner of the town home wanted to sell the property, no longer wanted to be in real estate management. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> . And so the real, the the leasing company says to me, Hey, we , we can't honor the , your lease beyond this. And because the owner's selling. And she said to me, do you wanna buy the town home ? And I immediately said, no. And the reason why I said no, because I thought all I was bringing to the table was money. Mm . What I didn't know about myself is that I could have brought credit Yeah . To the table. Somebody better hear what I just said. There's a , because I didn't know that about myself. I missed the opportunity to build wealth through real estate because I didn't trust my judgment. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> my judgment couldn't trust the table itself. So it's not just what you bring to the table. Do you trust the table? What do you know about the table? Yeah . I thought it was about money. 'cause nobody taught me how to negotiate my credit. Right . So I had to learn that my judgment was never about me. Yeah. It was about also the table. Good . And therefore, ooh , I'm about to say something when it comes to the relationship of reciprocity. Don't let everybody come to the table you about to eat on. Ooh . Teach. And , and it sucks because oftentimes it's not until you reflect after the fact that you become more able to accurately discern your table. Right . Right . So , but <laugh> , you know, learn yourself now. Yeah . So that you're prepared for whatever table's presented , uh, to you. 'cause even after years of experience and discernment, there's likely going to be times where you're going to have to judge the table and you don't want to misjudge the table. Yeah. We might misjudge other people's intentions. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . But if you don't misjudge the table, then you could say, no , you ain't got no seat here. <laugh> . Right . I'm sorry, you ain't got no seat here. You thought you did. If I know the table Right. Right. I know you, I look , I know the , I know the Maer D called Jon name . Right . But it wasn't at a reservation at , at this table. <laugh> . Right . <laugh> . Right . So maybe it's , see that's the thing, if I know right, right . If I know the table, then I know who to sit down and break bread with at the table. So sometimes the relationship of reciprocity is know your table. Yeah. Before you know who to bring to your table. That's good. Because not everybody's gifts can sit at the table. The opportunity that that, that you have. Uh , but again, that's, that's, that's kind of how we learn . We gotta cultivate a keener sense of your table. A keener sense of other people's motivation. You gotta cultivate in order to become more mindful of your own self, what you bring to the table, your own consciousness. And sometimes unconsciousness. 'cause sometimes we jump at a table 'cause it looks good, but we don't , we don't know it yet. Um, but you gotta, you , you gotta learn how to cultivate what knowledge, cultivate the relationship. Cultivate therefore you , you can trust and have better, better judgment. And you get rid of those impulses to give. And without getting, because an impulse drove you , uh, you know, what are, to me, some, some basic, you know , uh, questions you gotta ask yourself. And I hope this helps somebody. And , and learning , uh, how to learn a relationship. Reciprocity is , do you have any expectations of reciprocity? Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm. <affirmative> , like, you know, what are , what are your expectations? Will you be disappointed, resentful, or hurt or feel bad if they don't bring everything they need to bring to the table? Sure. Yeah . Uh, are you, are you letting go of what you are bringing to the table? Or are you holding on because you feel like you have a right on the way? It influences the way it impacts. I gotta control what I bring to the table. 'cause I need to control how we be better. Or, and we've said this before, is it obligatory? Why you're gifting, why you're giving. 'cause you feel obliged or shamed . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> or you feel pressured, you have to do it . Yeah . Or you feel guilted into doing it. So, so to me, those are some of the ways we learn , uh, reciprocity.

Anitra: 1:03:02

What's up Savage Siblings? I hope you guys are enjoying this discussion about the art of fair partnership and reciprocity. Not to mention learning how to negotiate in those spaces, which I learned effectively in dealing with my own brother. Y'all know how he is . Siblings, y'all know we teach each other the importance of reciprocity. So this episode digs a lot deeper into healthy reciprocity, transactional relationships, the pros and cons of learning when to give more and when to ask for more. So we get deep. You guys, I so hope you're gonna join us next time for part two of, I got five on it. I didn't sound really good when I say that, but you know what I mean. I've got five on it. Part two is coming at you. You don't wanna miss the transformational perspective, the quick shot. Andre's final Blow. So as always, thank you so much for joining us for part one. Please help us build the Savage siblings community. We need you guys to like, to share, to comment, leave a review, subscribe and send this to your favorite Savage sibling. Share your thoughts on how you learn the art of negotiation, maybe from your siblings, right? I know I did. We wanna hear about it. A huge shout out to the amazing team of people who make this all possible. Dwayne McClendon, Kyle Davis, our sound editors. Ronnie Maxwell of Maxwell Music. He's our music producer. Keith Cross of K Cross Photography for the amazing photos, our parents for their d n a and all the funny life lessons. And of course, you the listeners, we are so glad you guys are rocking with us. So we are gonna see you next time. And remember, don't go through life alone. Take care.