Get In Where You Fit In ~ Part One

Get in Where You Fit In is an episode that emphasizes the importance of enjoying who you are and what you’re doing to be your authentic self.  Andre and Anitra evaluate examples of unique people who refuse to conform to the norm, but have the confidence to embrace their individuality. This episode analyzes the need to be appreciated in our partnerships and relationships and how that appreciation can lead to positive self-awareness and personal identity. Dre unpacks how the position of the older sibling has inherent expectations that limit choice and can create frustration and Anitra speaks from the perspective of the younger sibling and the difference between “have to” versus “get to.”  

If you wonder why you didn’t feel like you belonged to your family, you will relate to this episode.  If you wondered how your family felt overwhelmed with family expectations, take a listen.  The Savage Siblings reflect on the difference between being needed and belonging to the family. Understanding these dynamics creates safe strategies to meet the needs of your family and partners in a healthy way.  This episode gives the listeners an opportunity to evaluate their relational value, which should create a healthy situation where you belong. 

Memorable quotes:

• Enjoy being the best of who you are. ~ Andre
• People can undergird you while the second wind is coming. ~ Anitra
• I can never have two bad days, because on the first day my tribe shows up and beats the drum. ~ Daniella
• God puts people in your life that are instrumental to help you get going. ~ Anitra
• We as human beings need to feel needed. ~ Anitra
• Belonging never ends, but being needed ends. ~ Andre
• The older sibling is the walking litmus test. ~ Andre
• The innate desire to be needed puts us in times of transition. ~ Anitra

Keywords:
#MentalHealth, #therapy,  #psychotherapy, #relationships, #psychology, #healing, #counseling, #ministry, #theology, #transformation, #change, #counselor, #therapist, #wholeness, #healthy, #health, #lifestyle, #mental, #emotions, #emotional, #spiritual, #minister, #christianliving, #christian, #wellness, #lifecoach, #forgiveness, #SavageSibling, #Savage, #Sibling,  #Brother, #Sister, #Family, #Parent, #S2Mediaworks, #SavageSiblingsPodcast, #Mytribe, #Beingauthentic, #Belongingvsneeding, #GetIn, #FitIn, #SeekingtoBelong, #Transitiontoindependence, #Passingonthemantle, #RelationalValue, #Diversesyndrome, #SelfAwareness, #Beyourself, #IntentionalBelonging,

Call to Action: 

• Post comments! Leave us a review!
• Share your thoughts on the need to be needed versus the belonging.  What’s it like to be the middle child?
• Any topics you want us to discuss?

Sound Editors: Kyle Davis and Dwayne McClendon
Music: Maxwell Music
Photography: K.Cross Photography

Brutally Honest. Relentlessly Transparent. Unapologetically Authentic.

Transcript

Anitra: 0:30

Hey , hey, beautiful people. How are we doing? I am Anitra in Lawson storyteller, producer, educator, content creator, the best sister in the world. Lord co co-sign that co-sign that

Andre: 0:43

I , I will buy . Your credit ain't good enough for me to co-sign with you, <laugh>.

Anitra: 0:49

He is Dr . Andre Eugene Evans. I love throwing his middle name out there so y'all can Google him and find out all of his history. Jesus ,

Andre: 0:58

Listen. No, there don't do that. They're actually, I've Googled my name before, and there's a guy who's been to prison for five years with my same person , last name, and then there's a football player . There's a football player with my first and last name too. So , yeah, don't be Google .

Anitra: 1:14

See ? So that , so that middle name is good, then <laugh> . Good to know that middle, that middle name is saving you right now.

Andre: 1:19

<laugh> . No , neither one of them names Saving me <laugh> . Anyways, what's going on? Savage Siblings,

Anitra: 1:25

And he is my brother. He is a father. He is a pastor. Theologian, author, creative , uh, the second best storyteller in the family. Joking, kidding , gene .

Andre: 1:36

No, no, no. I agree with that one. I'm not a storyteller at all. <laugh> .

Anitra: 1:41

And we are the Savage siblings. This is the Savage Sibling Podcast, where we are brutally honest, relentlessly transparent, and unapologetically authentic. Thank you so much for joining us for another episode, bro, bro, checking in with you. How you doing?

Andre: 1:57

I'm doing well, doing well, and getting ready for this episode. I , um, I have a good friend, well , she's part of the choir at , uh, at the church, and she comped me and some tickets for an upcoming , uh, concert. And I don't know why, but I looked at the, the flyer and I don't know why , uh, for those of you watching in Dayton or listening rather, in Dayton, Ohio. But it reminded me of a concert I went to with mom several years ago, and this is when I was , uh, married to Katina and Katina and I went to this concert. It was for Touch and the Touchups. Oh , <laugh> in Dayton . And , and oh God, they were just phenomenal. But, but the Flyer had a guy, you know, had all the band on there. And, and I'm looking at one guy who looks pretty prominent on the flyer , and the assumption is , is that he's the lead, but he's not. And , and this is why it reminded me of touching the touch-ups <laugh> several years back, <laugh> , when we went to that concert , uh, the guy , the guys came out, the band came out, singers came out, touch , started singing, and I mean, the Touchups are getting it. They in old school fashion, <laugh> doing their thing. And I'm gonna tell you, you know, as you're watching the concert, which is great, and it's great because they're local, it's great because they sing . So everybody in the crowd knows them . But I'm watching , and like in between touch and one of the touchups, all of a sudden this like tambourine pokes through, and it's just shaking , and then it disappears, <laugh> , and then it like pokes through again, and it's just shaking and then it disappears . And, and this tambourine is being held by hands that are not touches and not the touches up fans . And then all of a sudden, like party, like the Red Sea , this dude comes out with his tambourine, gets to the front of the stage. And I mean, when I tell you he had a whole church rhythm going, you know, that old lady in church bang, that tambourine on like beat seven and eight at three corner on her hips on her hand , man on her side , side everywhere, mean she's hitting rhythms on that tambourine. That just the Holy Spirit be proud. That's why they, you know, that song Make a Joyful Noise to the Lord. It was pinned after her. David was like, there's gonna be this woman in Che <laugh> . This gonna be her . That's what this dude is like. I mean, when I tell you he took over the rest of the show, we wasn't even listening to touch anymore. We wasn't even listening to the Touchups. We just got excited every time that little tambourine peeked through touch on a touchups start shaking right ? And his whole body emerged, and he was getting it. And I remember saying in that moment, look, whatever you do, get in where you fit in and do it well. And that's really what he did. He played that tambourine like nobody's business <laugh> . And , and , and so that , that made me laugh. And I felt like, man, God, you came up with the right just memory for this episode . Really, it doesn't matter what you're doing. Just, you know, whatever you do, <laugh> , I don't care if you a tambourine player, get in where you fit in and play that bad boy like nobody's business. I , I think I laughed on that for a few days. But , and , and , and what it really ended up doing for me the rest of the week is just like, can you just enjoy what you're good at doing everywhere you go? Yeah . Do you <laugh> ? Right? Just enjoy what you do wherever you go. Do you be the best? You don't, don't be trying to mimic mimic anyone else. Don't be, I've heard people say, oh , Andre, you go be the next. And I , and I always tell I ain't gonna be the next anybody. I'm gonna be the first best Dre. Just do . That's so good. B , just have a great time. I'll tell you , I was, I'm in the car, I'm doing my best car driver's seat moves in the car. I don't care anybody Right ? <laugh> looking . I'm just doing me. I just, man , I don't know his name. But , uh, for those of you listening to Dayton , if, you know, touching the touch up , I need you to get this, this episode. You know , they do know, right ? I need you to get this episode to the tambourine dude with touching the touch up . Let him know he has inspired me out . Me , he has inspired me. So, but yeah, I've been, I've been rocking with that energy all week long. I thought about it just everywhere I go , just enjoy my complete authentic self. Don't care what anybody think , I'm just gonna do . That's right .

Anitra: 6:15

That's

Andre: 6:15

Right . To me. And, and , and it , and it's a , you know, that stuff like that is infection. It's absolutely attractive. Yes . And , and , and , and it just changes the atmosphere. You just realize who you're in any atmosphere where you go when you just , just do you and enjoy being the best parts of you . So yeah. That, that's, that, that is what I've been , uh, vibing off of all week. That's what my energy is being thanks to Touch and the touchups tambourine playing . So, but that's me. What about you? What's been going on with you?

Anitra: 6:46

You know , your story reminds me, and I guys are gonna , they're gonna come through the, the speakers and get me on this. But I remember when I went to see Morrisey in the time, and isn't, isn't the gentleman's name Jerome? Jerome? Is that right?

Andre: 6:57

Jerome?

Anitra: 6:58

That's how your story reminded. 'cause the first time I saw them live, I was mesmerized at just how Yes . Energetic Yes . And dope. His energy was, and of course, you can't go wrong with Morrisey in the time , like Right . It's , it was a dope show, but I was like, Jerome ain't nothing like he's,

Andre: 7:13

He not play with <laugh>

Anitra: 7:14

A critical Yes . Integral, amazing part of this entire, you know, ensemble and experience. And so that's what I kept thinking. That's how I felt about him. And, and he knew it too. He was on the stage like, yeah, I'm here trip .

Andre: 7:27

I don't sing, I don't play the instrument, but this is what I do. <laugh> , get

Anitra: 7:31

That mirror. Bring it out. Like , I was like , go ahead Jerome,

Andre: 7:34

Man . Shout , shout out to all the Jerome, the tambourine players, the Macs for every James Brown. Right ? What is it? Bentley F's words for all that . That's what I was

Anitra: 7:44

Thinking for . Yeah . People

Andre: 7:46

Shout out for all to all those dude , shout out to Bishop Don Juan for the Snoop Doggs out there. There you go. <laugh> , shout out to all these players. I mean, because they really make the world go round. They're

Anitra: 7:57

Necessary serious . They really ,

Andre: 7:58

The world. They're so necessary. And if that's you, man, shout out to you . Like , God , God bless you . Hold that mirror . I love it . Play that tambourine. I love it . Open that umbrella. Put on the cape . Do what you gotta do . Put the cape on, put the tape on. God bless you people. God bless y'all. I

Anitra: 8:15

Love it. That's, that's truly what the , what your story reminded me of. And it was one of the best parts of that concert. I was so glad I got a chance to see them. But, but yeah, no, I'm doing really well. This, this week for me has been the week of like second win . Oh,

Andre: 8:29

Dang . Um,

Anitra: 8:29

And I think that's actually, you know, connects beautifully to, to the stories we just presented, that, you know, having those people in your corner that, you know, when you're trying to catch your breath and get that second win , they're usually the ones that really help fan that along, you know? Yeah. Yeah . And so I know just throughout this week, it's, it's just been very much of when I feel like I can't give another inch and I'm just like, Ugh , I really am tired, or I really wanna break, or just wanna let this go . Yeah . You know, God has been so good at just saying, I got you. And then I , he just, you know, graces me with a , a flood of a second wind to just keep going , uh, further. And I do feel like absolutely people around you can help undergird you, you know, while that second wind is building up mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And so, yeah. So I've been so grateful for that, that I could take that breath, take that beat, and know that a second wind , God's gonna bless me with that. People who love me, who around me Amen. Are gonna bless me with that second wind . And so I just soar forward . You soar on, it's , it's once it comes . So definitely grateful.

Andre: 9:27

Yeah. It's so, I love that, you know, Daniela, all my oldest daughter always mm-hmm . Says , um, I can never have two bad days because on my first bad day, my tribe, meaning her family, my tribe shows up and beats the drum and I get back up like I , she said that not too long ago . That's

Anitra: 9:46

Good . It

Andre: 9:46

Really is . And it so important to have those folk around you , um mm-hmm . <affirmative> and , and , and realize how valuable they're in that type of role in your life. And , um mm-hmm . <affirmative> , it's huge. It's huge. Yeah. When she said that, she said, I , I don't get dad, I don't get two bad days in a row, because when I tell you about my first bad day and you get on the line telling everybody to pray for me, I feel my tribe . That's it. Beating the drum, and I gotta get up and start going. And so, yeah. Yeah, man, those, those , that's so good. God puts those people in your life and they're so instrumental, they really, so valuable. Mm-hmm . Uh , everybody has value that that's in your tribe. Everybody has value . That's, you know , that you're , that helps you , you know , just kind of get your second win and keep going. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , so , yeah . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Absolutely . I feel that one .

Anitra: 10:34

I love it. I love it. Let's jump into this , uh, sound off segment. Sound

Speaker 3: 10:39

Off segment . Sound

Anitra: 10:41

Off . I'm gonna , um, go ahead and dig in here real quick. Okay . Because I was, when I was thinking about this episode, it came from a conversation that I was having with a , a few of my friends, really based on some creative endeavors that we're working on. Uh , but it , it kind of boiled down to this notion of, or this idea of that there's a , a fundamental need in every human experience to be needed, right? Like, that it's an important and vital part of the life journey that we as human beings need to feel needed. And I think that word feel is critical, which will definitely kind of unpack it a little bit later. But I mean, if you think about romantic relationships, right? There's a need to feel needed on both sides When you think about parents to children and children's to parents like that experience, certainly employers to employees, right?

Andre: 11:34

Absolutely. Ly

Anitra: 11:35

Absolutely . There's need , there's a give and take between those dynamics. I think really all manners of partnerships and friendships at the core . There's always that kind of need , uh, to feel needed. And so, you know, we titled this episode, get In Where You Fit In , uh, because we wanna spend some time today unpacking where that comes from, this need to feel needed and how you can mm-hmm . <affirmative> kind of navigate that. But , um, I totally wholeheartedly agree with this idea that there is a , a fulfillment, right, right. That we get that comes from wanting to be significant. Right? Right. Uh, even if it's just to one person, right. And then, you know, in feeling that desire to be significant to just one person or several, then obviously we wanna feel appreciated, feel valued , uh, for what it is that we bring. And so we always start the sibling sound off segment , uh, from our perspective as siblings. And so, yeah . Yeah . You know, I really can only truly speak from, you know, the baby, from the youngest sibling. Sure . And I certainly wanna kick it to you, bro, bro, to unpack the oldest perspective. But I'm gonna just be frank, you guys, I absolutely never felt <laugh> that I I , that I was needed in my family <laugh> . And lemme be clear, I was very happy about that. Right? I always recognized as the baby and the baby girl in our four , you know, four person home that I was the needy one. And yes, some people may call that spoiled <laugh> . Some people may call that , uh, I don't know . We'll get to, you know, the notions of codependency and things like that. But I was actually happy. Like you think about it, we all had to do chores, right? Well, maybe dad didn't, but me and you and mom did chores growing up. Yeah . Yeah. But I never once thought, Hmm , if I don't do these dishes, oh, the family will fall apart. Oh , look , this , if I don't do this , you know , take out the track . If I don't do these things right , uh, everything is going to fall into calamity. No, I understood that. I, and I'm gonna really kind of emphasize this for the, for the youngest sibling, it's a , it's a, I get to rather than have to Sure. Right. I get to do this rather than have to, and that was always really special to me because it really started to shape my mindset good and bad, <laugh> . Right , right . Which we'll talk about. But I think, and I did some research on younger siblings in terms of how we contribute to families and, and how we feel about where we're needed. Research shows that the youngest baby siblings often sought out fun experiences more than maybe the older or the middle child. Sure , sure . Because we understood we were the needy ones. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> , uh, we understood that when we came into, you know, this life, our mindset was not about, oh, they need me. It was like, no, you've already laid out this land and everything that's here. You've already created a brand for the family, and I get to partake in all of it. Right, right, right. So my mindset <laugh> as a younger sibling was, what's mine is mine, and what's yours is mine. Yeah . Because we've already laid , laid out . That's exactly how I felt. Right. <laugh> , I was never once concerned about my needs being met. Right . It didn't even exist. They were always met. I didn't question it. And obviously we're talking about being blessed to be raised in a healthy home. Not perfect, obviously, but healthy where things were in place. But so when I was unpacking my perspective as a younger sibling in terms of the need to feel needed, that dre that didn't even hit me Right. Until I was an adult. Right . Like, it didn't become a reality for me until I was out of the house. Right. Which is an important thing to, to start to learn. And obviously your parents will, will guide you. They try to make sure you're not spoiled. Try to help you learn maturity and we'll , we'll get into that. But it was very much my experience of I get to contribute. I don't have to. Right. It was very much my experience that everything that my family has is mine. And I actually can even lean into what's mine is mine. And more than likely, because I'm the baby, because I'm the youngest, no one's gonna say, oh no, you , you know, you have to share that per se, or you have to contribute, because if you don't, the family's gonna fall apart. And so, when I think about this question is , you know, as siblings, do we understand that we're needed? And I wanna hear from our listeners. For me, as the youngest, no, I did not understand <laugh> or ever feel like I was needed for the strength of the family until I became an adult, or until I moved out of the household and started learning, you know, more of the, the nuances of life. And so I just didn't feel it. I didn't feel it. I was protected. I was spoiled. I did never , I never felt like I needed to, you know , contribute by, by necessity. It was more about, you're part of it, you're the baby, we're gonna undergird you. And so I love that space and it definitely , uh, put me into an environment of independence that I'll definitely unpack more, but I wanna kick it to you , uh, just to see your thoughts on just the subject for today from the sibling perspective. Certainly you as an older brother, you know, what are your thoughts as we dig into this?

Andre: 16:28

I'm over here shaking my head and <laugh> and , and angst <laugh> . The audacity <laugh> . Right . Of every , of everything you just said, the , the audacity of ,

Anitra: 16:42

And listen, and younger siblings let us know if that was your experience. 'cause I, I think it was for a lot

Andre: 16:47

Of this . No ,

Anitra: 16:47

It's ,

Andre: 16:47

But I wanna hear back . No , go ahead, bro . Bro , it's, it's the experience of every younger sibling. And that's, and that's <laugh> . This is a PG show . Okay . That's , that's bull Man . I'm tell you . No , that's , that's , and I know that's how you felt. Uh mm-hmm . <affirmative> . I'm not, not, I didn't , I didn't know it in real time. Sure. But you know, if I, I've laid out the groundwork. So all you gotta do is just simply partake in the fruit of all the labor I had to have. And do not, not only because I was there before you, but because mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I was a freaking trial run. Mom and dad didn't understand how to, what, what, what children were needed for. And they also didn't know , understand how to make children feel needed in a healthy way. So I'm the trial run. So, so do I understand what you know, that I needed? Sure. But I understand it through being rejected first. I understand it through being rejected on so many levels. Like I understand it through like, well, why I gotta do all this? How come Nikki can't do it? Rejection? Nope . Because I said, so she's the baby . She's delicate. Well , why does she always have to come with me? Why can't I go be independent by myself? Rejected. Like, I, so I understand being needed through being rejected of the things I actually wanted Yeah . To do in life. I , and , and , and , and , and see for you. Yeah. You know, I , I'm hearing how you ingested that on a mental level. And I'm shaking my head because what I ingested was social pain. Andre, why your sister always gotta come with us. Social pain. Andre, why you can't come out? Why you gotta babysit your sister? Social pain ? Like , I dunno , like, I'd like No, no, I'm needed wrong. Like, this isn't what I wanna be needed for <laugh> , you were needy. I was. And all of it was wrong. All of it was wrong. There's no part of this that was this , it runs a gamut. This we're talking about emotional pain that went psychological, emotional damage and physical. Right . Emotional damage. Damage. Right. <laugh> , because No, no . Okay. You , you processed it different. Look at how you processed it . Like everything was laid out for you. It was great. It was you, were you , I said, what's mine is mine. What you want is mine. That's exactly how I was treated. Not just from you, but from even a parental standpoint. Yeah . It was No, Andre, you gotta share that. That ain't just for you. But she didn't put in on this. Like , she didn't do work on this . I could be out with my boys. Y'all made me be here . Y'all just , no , no . You know , it's , it's crazy because, you know, I'm looking at this and I'm saying to myself, well , wait a minute, <laugh> , I did, I , I laid this beautiful path and I didn't mean to lay it. I was forced to lay it. Right . Just living late . Right . <laugh> laid this beautiful path. And, and what I came out with is, Andre, we need you to do this. So I've got a definition of being needed that's clearly different from your definition of being needed . It's huge . And , and it also mm-hmm . <affirmative> , we'll , I'll unpack this in a second. Um, what I had to learn is how to shift from being needed to saying, I belong , which is two different things. Ooh . Wow. That's good. You walked in saying, I belong . Mm-hmm. <affirmative> , you didn't have to go through the needed and, and see. And if I can just give a difference mm-hmm . <affirmative> , when people don't understand needed versus being, feeling belong when you feel, when you feel needed, the flip side of that is when you don't feel like you're getting your needs met . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , it can be detrimental. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> mm-hmm . <affirmative> . So that's why you're able to say, no , I had a beautiful life . They weren't perfect , but I had everything I needed because I had to go through what the, the process of understanding of Yeah. Uh, I know what it feels like to be needed now. I just wanna belong. I don't wanna feel needed because then if I don't get my needs met, met, yeah. Uhhuh , then I become, I think it's like a psychologists call it wallflower syndrome. What , what I mean is, is Yeah . Is is now I'm that person at the dance that's begging for somebody to ask him to dance. And nobody does. So I just stand on the wallflower, don't feel needed. I , I become the last person picked in the sports, in the basketball at the blacktop. And, and , and that's what I'm known for. Dre always picked last. Nobody really wants him . Right . Right . <laugh> So, so, so, but, but, but when you shift and you're able , and again, we'll unpack this later, but when you shift mm-hmm . Then you're saying to yourself, okay, no, no, no, I'm gonna get in. Where I fit in when I'm, when I get to the point of understanding is, is no, I wasn't needed. I belong . And I, and , and Yeah . And it's the way I belonged that allowed me to say, this feels good to be here now. This, this feels good to be, so I didn't experience what you felt coming up mm-hmm. <affirmative> until an adult. Right. And then I had to be able to say, okay, I have all these tangible , uh, transient skills and, and ethic that I learned in the home, but I don't know why. But now that I'm out here in the real world by myself, I remember when, when Kaylin and I first moved all the way across the world to Tallahassee to go to Florida State mm-hmm . <affirmative> , we belonged . We felt like we belonged for the first time because it wasn't a chore anywhere anymore. It was Right . No, no. This is just kind of who we are . Get to , you know. Right . Get to choose . We have the privilege of running our apartment any the way we wanna run it, and not just the way we wanna run it. Kaylin was good at this. I was good at that. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And so we felt like we belonged in the apartment together. Um, ver versus feeling like I'm, I'm needed. Because , you know, when you feel like you're needed or if you understand being needed, well, what happens when they don't no longer need you? Mm-hmm. <affirmative> , teach , teach , teach them . But when you feel like you belong, that doesn't end. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , that doesn't end at all. Um , what what might end is the duties of being of you belong. But, but , uh, the , the feeling of belonging never ends. And so that's what I'm hearing you talk about it. Yeah . That , that was where I was at <laugh> . That's what I was feeling in . And , and because , 'cause think of it, think of, think of it as , so for the older sibling mm-hmm . <affirmative> , we're not just needed. We're needed, but we're fighting for independence as well . Yes . That's it . That's right . Word . So , so while Yeah . Mom is saying , I need you to do this , I need you to do that . I don't ever , I don't reach the needy , like the spoiled. Right . I , like, I never felt that I didn't reach the needy what I was, I need you to do that , need that . And I'm saying, but I'm trying to get out this house because I'm trying to be independent <laugh> . Yeah. And , and as long as I'm in this place, I can't meet milestones. Like there's, there's nothing more of a milestone for me to be able to come back to the home and say to Nikki , yeah, we was out balling and we did this, this , this independence of parenthood mm-hmm . <affirmative> mm-hmm . <affirmative> , um, that , that I can't reach as long as I am needed versus if I were the younger sibling and I'm needy. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> what feels like spoiled, then <laugh> , then I don't, I don't feel the need to break away an independence because I feel like I'm in this path where I belong. So I think there's , there's so many different , there's so many different angles to that being the older sibling and the younger saying, and what I'm most interested in mm-hmm . For those of you listening is what do you , what, what do you feel if you're the middle child?

Anitra: 24:46

That's exactly what I had . Yes.

Andre: 24:48

Yes . What , what , what is that? Because that, that experience mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I actually, you know, I actually don't, I don't dunno . You

Anitra: 24:53

Don't , yeah. We don't know it . Yeah . I don't know .

Andre: 24:54

I was too busy trying to wiggle my way out of being needed. I was too busy trying to get through just kind of again, that, that natural development struggle as an adolescence. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> where , you know, the family is depending on me, but I'm trying to get my independence and, and, and I'm , I'm trying to rely on friends more than I am on my parents. And, and , but there's a , but there's also a detriment to that as well. Uh , now that I think about it, because that detriment is, is I know what , well , mom and dad, well, I'm the trial run as the child. Right? Right . They say , well, first time first, right. So I know you're mm-hmm . <affirmative> , you're being pulled by your friend , but I still need to give you guidance even outside this house. So even that mm-hmm . <affirmative> . So part of the feeling needed versus feeling belong was , was mom and dad saying, I'm not ready to just release you carte blanche to your friends because they can't guide you. Right . They're still trying to get their independence too. Whereas when you come along and say , okay, well we screwed up this with Andre. We ain't gonna do this <laugh> . Like , we , we messed up with this way with re <laugh> this with Nicki . You know, they're looking at all the thing I'm the , I'm , I'm the walking litmus test, and I'm just the three of y'all huddling on the side. Like Yeah . You see the way he walked . That's , we can't let Nick walk that way. You , you gotta change that . What he look Yeah . We can't let it , you know, so it's, it's , it , it really is this , uh, so I'm not just needed in what I do, I'm needed so that mom and dad can learn how to do better with you. And that sucked too . That absolutely sucked .

Anitra: 26:25

And I imagine most older children probably share that sentiment to some extent too. So .

Andre: 26:32

Yeah . Heck yeah. I

Anitra: 26:33

Had , so I had the same, the same notes in terms of that question for middle children. And please, we do, we definitely want you guys to, to let us know, 'cause we're take , taking this from our perspective and our experience, but curious if you're a middle child, because you think about the older child , uh, often directly or indirectly takes on responsibility for also modeling, you know, the brand of the family, whether you want to or not to your younger siblings. And so mm-hmm . Sometimes there's perfectionism that sits , that sets in because you're, you know, you're trying to do what your parents said, trying to, you know, help the younger child, you know, rear differently. And you get , kind of get forced into that position. Um, and other times, like you said, you're trying to find ways to, to get the responsibility outta the way so you can move on to your own independence. Hmm . And certainly for the youngest child, that babysitting mindset or, you know, kind of coddling or everything is there. But I agree that middle child might feel very much lost in translation. Yeah. Absolutely. Feel like they can't figure out the, you know, how to navigate the family dynamics , uh, because they don't necessarily take on the responsibility of the older children. And obviously they're not getting the attention of the babying, per se, of the youngest. And so I definitely would like to, to hear from that. But I think the thing that you, you said that really struck me, because we'll talk about this as we get to the savage segment, is this notion of , uh, transition in it mm-hmm . Mm-hmm. <affirmative> . Yeah . So where for you it was like you said , um, seeking to belong as you got out into your freedom and adulthood. Right. Um, uh, for me, it, I had to learn the role of, you know, needing to be needed as I got into adulthood. Yeah . So then I started navigating that. And I think for you, you started protecting independence, which I was absolutely doing that early on. Right. Uh , because of my status. And so yes, it feels like that, you know, the, the innate, you know, desire , uh, to , to need to be, to feel needed , uh, puts us in transitions, puts us in spaces throughout life where we kind of toggle between or pinging pong between, or just kind of flow between that based on where we are in our life. And I think, I think that's kind of why it's so important , uh, to recognize it. Yeah . To spend time thinking about it because of different seasons. You're gonna have to contend with it. I was thinking about our grandfather mm-hmm . <affirmative> , um, and this goes, you know, beyond the dynamics of siblings, but still speaks to how family deals with the need to feel needed , um, in different, you know, just different iterations in life. And I remember when he was , um, close to, to dying. Oh yeah . You know, he had been sick a few times , uh, in and out, and we've talked about our grandfather a lot on the podcast and probably will continue to do so. 'cause he was just such a dope human being. Absolutely. Was . Uh , but so he took pride. Like grandpa loved being the provider. He did the protector. He absolutely , you know, giving of identity. And I mean, and you could speak to this too, bro, bro , you know, having a wife and , and a daughter. He, you know, he lost his, his son at a young age. And , uh, I think that one other little girl, one other mm-hmm. <affirmative> , uh, passed away. But, so, you know, I imagine as a man that's even more heightened when you have a wife and a daughter. Like two beautiful Sure thing . Sure . Girls , women to take care of. And so when mom was talking to me about the last couple of months , you know, let's say weeks, months in his life, 'cause he was, you know, he took pride in, you know, obviously working, taking care of home, providing the house, et cetera. And then when it got to where he retired, you know, I watched Grandpa take pride in washing clothes. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> cooking the meals and <laugh> , you know, fixing things around the house. And then even when it got to where he was on a walker and things like that, he still took pride in, you know, making the meals and pushing it on his walker to my grandma. Yeah . <laugh> . Yeah . And setting it next to her. And that might be the two things he did all day, but he would still do it. Which speaks to , um, I definitely think there's seasons of our life where not only do we value the need to, to be needed, but it really becomes a key part of our identity. Yeah, absolutely. Because I think about it with our mom, I think we could all probably agree grandparents very much , uh, get into that space where they're like, I I love being here to support my children, my grandchildren, my great grands . I , as matter of fact, I heard , uh, Kareem Abdu, Abdul-Jabbar talking about the last, you know, several years of his life, how much he's enjoyed being around his grandkids and great grandkids. Yeah . I read that. I read that. And he's like, you need to tell me I can lay down and play Legos with them rather than go do a sports interview. Like , right . Like, I'm good. Like this season of my life, I , I thank my career, my basketball career. I thank all those beautiful things, but now I can just play Legos. Like, let's go. Right. That's a need to feel needed, right? Yeah. Yeah. And so I think we start to learn in different seasons why it's so important to recognize it , uh, because it will fulfill you. And so, you know, with Grandpa Dangerfield, that very much was that season of his life. And so when it came down to the point to where he got sick and had been hospitalized, and at the initial mindset, the way mom described it was, at first they were kind of like, okay, what do we need to do medically so we can just get him home? Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And so, you know , they're figuring out medication, different options. And so she described those days. She would go to the hospital every day . Mom went to see , to see grandpa, and they would play Chinese checkers and cards. Yeah . Yeah . It was still fairly positive. 'cause the, the focus was, you know, what do we need to do to get you back home? The unfortunate side of that is once they realized there was nothing medically that could be done, and I , you know, grandpa was like, I think 92, 93 when he passed away, so , you know, good years mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And they realized , okay, no , this season of his life is, is coming to an end. Mom told me the shift in his focus, uhhuh , which, which Dre speaks to exactly what we're talking about in this podcast. He immediately understood. And I mean, she said he cried and she remembers the , the moment where he just kind of went into prayer with God. And I , I totally believe they had their conversation where God said, son, you've run your race. It's time for you to come on home. Mm-hmm . And gave him, you know, the opportunity to have , uh, the last couple of, you know, day , maybe weeks or so, to really pour into our mom to help her understand now that it's time for me to go on and my journey has ended where, you know, my ability to take care of the needs is now gonna transfer to you because you're gonna have to step in and take care of your mother. Mom said that he spent like an entire afternoon, literally just going through, creating like a checklist. And when I tell you it was a checklist of emotional needs for grandma and emotional needs for her and financial needs and physical needs Yeah. And running it down because he had been that person. Yes . Yes . That understood. I have to be the need to be, I have to be okay, you know, being needed for my daughter, who's a grown woman who can take care of herself, but I'm still there . Right . And for my wife. And so she said it got serious, and it was really hard, obviously, to, to kind of go through that with your dad and , and see that, you know, his, his life is coming to , uh, closure. And she said that Dre, after he had that conversation with her, that then he, he just got quiet. And she said he really never talked much more after that, even though I think he lived for another week or two. Yeah. Um, but he understood he was passing the mantle on, he was passing the torch on. And I think probably part of it too is it's probably very difficult when you've been used to being that person that understands that the need to be needed, and you realize you can no longer be that. 'cause he wasn't able to walk anymore, or even on a walker. He wasn't able to get outta the bed. And , um, and then she, she even described it as a very , uh, I don't know if the right word is stoic, but just a strength that came through him that after he had that, that moment with God and cried, she said he never cried again. That he was rested . Mm-hmm . He was at peace after . Yeah . And he said to her, and she said, when she came into the hospital that day, when he really kind of poured into her all of the things , uh, she said she'd never seen him more serious because she came in with , with the UNO cards and the Chinese checkers. It was like , you ready to take this whooping? He was like, Nope, we got , we got business. That's

Andre: 34:30

What we're doing right

Anitra: 34:30

Now . We got business . Yep .

Andre: 34:31

We got family

Anitra: 34:32

Business. Um, and I believe that it was very fulfilling for him to be, you know, the an , you know, to be able to, to step in and be what they needed. And so I feel like we all get an experience with that, sometimes more than once throughout our life journey. And so just really understanding how you feel about the need to be needed and making sure it's healthy, but then also recognizing when you need help. I think that's what we're gonna unpack from there. But I'll kick it back to you before we get to the sponsorship. Well,

Andre: 34:59

No, I, I , I think through that story, you know, you, you, everyone can get a better understanding of , uh, or at least a better consideration if they're needed when you just kind of think about , uh, those kind of important people in your life, whether they're family mm-hmm . <affirmative> or friends mm-hmm . <affirmative> , uh, significant other members of your community, even your job. And as you kind of thinking about them kind of reflecting on how much they actually kind of care about you , um, how much, how much they internalize your interests , like the things that you're interested in in life , um, things like how much they , uh, would sacrifice for you and emotional sacrifice. Mm-hmm . Mental, not just financial or physical, but just, you know, all these different layers of , of sacrifice, how much they respect you, how much they admire you. You know , when you , when you're feeling all of that, and you see that value sense, that value in all of those areas, then the thing about being needed is now showing you just this positive psychological , uh, life existence wellbeing. Right? Mm-hmm. <affirmative> . So , so this is the good , you know , feeling needed is not a , you know, doesn't always have to be a bad thing. I think sometimes people feel like when they, when they're always needed in a certain way, it's a bad thing. But sometimes feeling needed is a good thing. So don't , it's a good thing. We don't , we don't wanna misconstrue, conflate, we don't wanna mm-hmm . <affirmative> confuse what you're being requested of as they're just trying to walk over you or drain you. Yeah . Sometimes, yeah . It's coming from a space that's deeper than what you're seeing or what you're hearing or what you're feeling. It's coming from a , a place that's actually showing, no, there's an actual psychological wellbeing of this person's need for you. But again, the flip side of that is, if you did that same reflection and you feel slightly depressed, or you feel slightly disconnected, <laugh> , or you feeling , you know, the opposite of , of good, then chances are your , your relational value, whether it's your expectations, your needs that are being unmet, what you're feeling in terms of what you deserve , uh, is low. And, and I , and , and , and the , the idea there is to have a high relational value, because the higher my relational value, the more healthy the need is. In fact, the higher the relational value, the more you actually translate from feeling needed to feeling like you belong. And that's ultimately where you wanna get to , is feeling like you belong, not just needed . Needed is probably a, a great pivot point, because either you're either rejected, needed, or which we're looking for in relationships is a high enough relational value that you feel like you belong here. Uh , what I , yes, people need what I bring to the table, but the overarching feeling is, but I belong and that's why I'm needed. And then that's ultimately kind of what we, we wanna , we wanna go to. So yeah, that story about , um, grandpa, it it , if you notice , it even shifted mom from being needed to belong. Yes . Right. Because when he says, I'm passing the torch to you. Mm-hmm . Why , why didn't I pass it to hospice? Why didn't I pass it to a nursing home? Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , because grandma doesn't belong there. Ooh . Teach program . And you don't belong there as a visitor teach program , right ? No . We're putting two people together , because they'll be honest with you. Okay . Uh , you, I remember dad saying, we put this in a podcast last season. I remember dad saying to you, I believe after mom and dad had separated, that mom had to go back to date because she needs to be with family . Whereas dad is like, now I'm gonna stay here in the dub K because I don't need none of y'all <laugh> . Like , I belong by myself, <laugh> . So , you know what I mean? And that's okay, because he knows where he belongs . Because I'm like , dad, I , I'm like , dad , I said , I , I can , I can live in San Diego by myself. Uh, you know, I don't, I don't have to be with fa I , I , you know, I, I definitely belong you value.

Anitra: 39:20

Sure. Yeah .

Andre: 39:21

I value family. Yeah . Yeah . I belong as my mama's son, my dad's son, my sister's brother . Mm-hmm . I belong there, but I don't need to be in their physical space. And , and see that's, that's the shift when you have a healthy situation where you're needed mm-hmm . <affirmative> a healthy one . Belonging is that area where you get in , where you fit in is that area where you're not getting in, where you fit in , you're forced to be there . And we don't wanna feel that way. We definitely don't wanna feel that way. So, yeah. That's , uh, I know we're getting ready to go into the sponsorship. Uh, uh, shout , shout out . But yeah, I love that story about grandpa , um, yeah . Shifting and , and saying, now you know, Lois, because he didn't call it Delo. Lois. You're right . You , you're , you're , you're, you're no longer needed. You belong right now. You Absolutely. That's so good . And , and what's crazy, Nikki , I know we gotta do sponsor, but what's crazy, Nikki , is I heard a shift in mom's conversation about being whole

Anitra: 40:22

Hundred percent right? Yep .

Andre: 40:23

Before, before this moment in , in mom's life mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I definitely felt like mom was a caretaker. Like I moved back home to be a caretaker. Yeah .

Anitra: 40:38

Yes ,

Andre: 40:38

Yes . But after this moment, I heard the words of a daughter. And I think that's so different. So different. And, and that's such a different , and , and that's the thing, when mom was making her transition from Dayton to la prior to that transition, Nikki , you , we were, we were talking as caretakers,

Anitra: 40:58

Caretakers, percent . But after

Andre: 41:00

We had that conversation with mom at the park mm-hmm . <affirmative> mm-hmm . We were talking as, as her children. And that's such a different stance. Agreed. Agreed . That's such a different stance. One is needed. The other is, no , ma , you belong here with Nicki . With Nikki , not with Andre, but you belong here. See how he does

Anitra: 41:20

Me in this

Andre: 41:21

Region

Anitra: 41:22

Temporarily. <laugh> , I keep saying I'm gonna drop her out . <laugh> . Speaking of belonging , uh, let's shout out our sponsor for this episode . None other than S two MediaWorks, a media production company co-founded my , by my brother and I, and our focus is we're creating content to educate, empower, inspire, and encourage positive living and influence through original narratives. We love telling stories. We love sharing our journey. We love sharing our scars. Right? Like it's all part of growth, and it helps us, and hopefully it's helping you . Our mission at S two Media Works is to provide transformational education, hopefully resources that are gonna promote healthy and productive living through creative storytelling. And , um, we're dedicated to doing that each and every day. The Savage Siblings podcast is a product of SS two media , uh, our lineup, and we have so many other projects that we have in the canon that we can't wait to share with you. So, as always, thank you so much for joining us for this episode. And with that, bro , bro , you ready to get savage?

Andre: 42:29

Yeah , definitely. Let's definitely get Savage . So, as Nikki said , the title of this episode is , is get in Where You Fit In . And so as we're just kind of looking at that notion , you know, that , that need to be needed, need to understand your place with , you know, in any particular dynamic, relational or structural, whatever it might be. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , you know , one of the things that, that Nikki already said, and I wanna unpack here for just a moment, is that we really are created for belonging where we're created to be needed . And , and we're , we're , we created it in that, in such a way that it's not just about what you bring to the table, what you do, it's really about who you're, that makes difference as to whether or not it's a healthy need or, or an unhealthy need . So, like Nikki , if I said something , if I said to you , uh, here's an infant that's cuddling and being protected by their mother. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , or I say to you, here's an adolescent girl that's asked out on a date by a boy who she had a crush, who she has a crush on. Right . Or I say to you, here's this student athlete who's carried being carried on the shoulders of his teammates off the field because he just scored the winning goal. Mm-hmm . Or if I say, here's an employee that was fired by his boss and receives no calls or expressions of concern. If all of those kind of bring out some type of emotion, like most people, we're gonna have some type of, of emotion from these very brief descriptions of what it is I'm talking about, what it , these scenarios I brought out , whether it's empathy, or whether it's hurt, or whether it's joy, whatever it might be, whatever brief emotional experience that that was just had when I talked about these things, then you're in the subject , or at least you have the understanding of why we created for relationship . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , here's my mm-hmm . <affirmative> , who did you see as yourself? So when I said the infant and the mother, who did you see as yourself? The mother or the infant? Or what did you see of yourself? Did you see yourself showing up as the one, you know , you're , you definitely knew to cuddle or you , you knew how to soothe the baby. Right? So, so in all these scenarios, you end up kind of seeing yourself as something that's good . And here's the reason why. Um , uh, here's the reason why when I say, when we say, get in where you fit in, when we say you, there's you , we all have a need to be needed because we were created for relationship. We were created for belonging. Mm-hmm . It's because we have this intuitive psychology. And that intuitive psychology says, I'm in a scenario, whether it's a relationship or a institution, or a system, I'm in this and I'm valued my relationship mm-hmm . To the scenario brings value out of me. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And when I, when, when, so when I look at my value in any situation, that's what helps me know, am I in a healthy belonging or an unhealthy needing ? And , and , and that's a struggle for most people to Yes . Uh , both understand and respond to. And the reason I say struggle is because if I'm in a healthy belonging, then I, then , then the struggle might not be there so much. But the struggle shows itself when we're struggling to be who we're authentically because belonging requires authenticity. Lemme just be me. And if I'm just me in this situation and I still fit really well, and I'm still contributing, and I'm still pushing forward the scenario of the situation, then that's a healthy belonging. Some people are in a belonging, but they don't know who they're Right . And they don't know , they don't know the value of just being themselves. And so that becomes into a , that ends up being an unhealthy , uh, needing . And then there are those on the flip side, that they're only there because they just wanna feel needed by somebody . Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . Needed by something, because the majority of their experiences in life, it's been rejection. Mm-hmm . It's been ostracized. Mm-hmm . It's been, you don't really belong here. You don't fit in here. You don't look like us. You don't act like us. And so at the , you know , so , so they don't have the relational value that comes with needing with a healthy belonging versus an unhealthy needing. And so I say it's a struggle because do people really know their val their relational value whenever they step onto a particular scene , situation, scenario, circumstance, whatever it may be, every room I walk in, I know my relational value. Now, part of it is because I can be highly egotistical and I can be like , I don't <laugh> . So that's a great portion of who I am , that that helps me say . Right . That's important to know . I , I know. But , but I also believe there is a healthy balance between being Yes . Being , knowing your value and independence, and knowing your value independence, or what I'm gonna call belonging, so mm-hmm . <affirmative> , but there are a lot of people that walk into a room and they're just uncertain. Yeah . They're just absolutely uncertain of who they're supposed to be here and the and mm-hmm . And , and I , and , and that's why I say sometimes it's a struggle just to be yourself. Like, I don't ever wanna be in a situation or a room or amongst company where I can't just be me. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , I , I just can't just let me flow. And sometimes for me, that's difficult to overcome initially because most people know me from Sunday morning. Yeah, yeah . But I am not Sunday morning. No, no, no , no. I'm complex . Yeah . No , I'm , I'm definitely more complex. So, so sometimes it's a struggle not for me to be myself as much as it's for me to come to be somebody, be like, <laugh> , listen, I Yes, yes. I was coming out of the book of Matthews this morning, but now I'm coming outta this Pinot noir and I'm gonna be all right . You gonna be all right ? Yes. I was coming from the theological teachings of John , but yes . Mm-hmm . Now I'm finna come from the beverage teachings of, of Bud Light, and I'm You gonna be alright ? You gonna be alright ? Look , I'm not saying pray for , pray for you gonna be alright , <laugh> . You gonna be alright ? Because listen, I belong at this sports bar. I belong in this movie theater <laugh> . I belong at this amusement park I like , like these , you know what I'm saying? So , so , so for some people it's a struggle because you know what? You're, you're , you're , you're carrying yourself on the job one way. You're carrying yourself in your home. Another way you carrying yourself in church. Another way you carrying yourself on the road another way. Mm-hmm . Who are you? And see that, that kind of dilute , that's goods your relational value. And you may not ever get a sense of belonging because you're just, you're morphing everywhere. You go. Here, I need , that's so good to be this here. I need to be that here. I need to be this. No. Everywhere I go, I belong here. Why? 'cause I'm this, I belong here. Why? 'cause I am this. I don't ever say I need , I'm <laugh> . I'm this, I'm, people come up to Corin and Corey all the time, be like , uh, you , your dad's crazy. And they'll be like, yeah, why? Because I'm crazy with them. <laugh> , I'm crazy on the job. I'm crazy in the church. I'm crazy with them . D I'm crazy on the road . <laugh> , I'm , I'm crazy. Grocery store . In the grocery store. I'm crazy. It's just , that's so , so , you know, because to me, that's my relational value. That's absolutely my relational value. People will tell me on Sunday morning, you , you just real when you up there, because I'm not finna come up there speaking the Queen English talking about these , and th <laugh> coming up , thumb out . I done went through hell yesterday, but thank God for God, thank God for Jesus. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> <laugh> . I almost cussed somebody out yesterday. But thank God for the Holy Spirit. Right . Because I'm just , and , and , and that's what I'm saying on Friday, and that's what I'm saying on Sunday. That's what I'm saying on Wednesday night, and that's what I'm saying on Sunday. Yeah . You know , I'm like , I just, can you, can you find , can you belong because you're just being you. That's your relational value. And that's why people say, man, we need you around. Why? Because you just being yourself. That's , they belong.

Anitra: 51:07

That's authentic. Ooh ,

Andre: 51:08

That's good. Yeah. Yeah.

Anitra: 51:10

That's good. I love that. Um , and I co-sign all of it. And the trouble is real. I think when I was kind of processing it, it's, it's what you say , it starts with you really Analyzing yourself and understanding who you are as you're now going through life, where life is going to require , um, that that kind of, I don't know if duality is the word, but the both sides of the coin of being needed and mm-hmm . And then , you know, trying to also maintain your independence. So I put, I labeled it the verse syndrome. Yes. Um , and please, you guys don't, don't come, don't come at me, y'all. I love verses , I love verses like the next person, the millions of people that love it. But I loved it as it evolved to a space of you didn't have to air, quote, choose a winner, because I'm, I'm telling you, earth, wind and Fire and Isley Brothers, they're, they're both equal , equally dope . That's the best one in their own ways . Yeah . Right.

Andre: 52:00

Yeah .

Anitra: 52:00

And so I think that same kind of, you know, I'll say , uh, loose , uh, comparison when we're kind of defining ourself . I mean, for me, I never liked the pressure of being needed. And that comes from me being the , the youngest child. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . Mm-hmm . <affirmative> that comes from, you know , nature of being spoiled, things like that. Because I felt like that pressure was a threat to my independence, right? Yes. Yeah. And so I was raised as an independent young woman. So there's, there's layers, which is what bro , bro was saying about the complexity of understanding who you are as you delve into how you're going to navigate the need to be needed and the need to control. 'cause that's really the thing. When we're kind of on the pro independent side, what we're also saying is, I want to build spaces that I own. 'cause I wanna be able to control it, to control my independence so that I can what, so I can give it at will or I can protect it at will. And so when you're kind of navigating this versus space of, I, I value my independence. I value that space where I can keep people out. Where I don't have to say, oh, you need help. No, no, no, no. That's gonna take something from my independence. Yeah . Yeah . That means I gotta give you some of mine. Uh, that versus syndrome says, Hey, you don't have to choose. Life is not about choosing that independence versus if you're going to give and someone else's, you know, I'll call it that vulnerability of needing versus if you're gonna help somebody, you , you're gonna go back and forth. And so you have to first really get an understanding, like Andre just really presented of who you are . Yeah. And be okay. Yeah . You know, being that person that there's times where your independence needs to be protected and maybe you're not the answer to someone else's need. And then there's times where no , you need to step up and be , uh, uh, you know, give and support and provide some resources to someone else. I'll give you a couple of examples. I was dating this guy who lived in Sacramento and I , you know, I was in LA and I would fly out to visit him on certain weekends. And so, you know, in my desire, you know, <laugh> to be independent Uhhuh , I would just, you know, go park the car at the airport, fly out for the weekend and come back. And you guys know that's girl . There's a girls code 1 0 1, always one of your girlfriends has to know where you're going. Yeah. How long you going be so just for your safety. Right. But my desire to protect my air quotes, independence. I foolishly was making these trips without letting, and I definitely wouldn't let family know. Yeah .

Andre: 54:21

Because don't know nothing about this <laugh>.

Anitra: 54:24

I've been delivered set free . Right. And so, but the one, one of the weekend , uh, I'm flying back to LA and um, somebody , uh, they, they jacked me. You guys, they took my wallet. Uh , 'cause I would, I would ride the little shuttle to go to the, the parking ride I'd park . We had the , you know, the cheapest rate for the weekend. Oh Lord . And I get from in the shuttle, and I know the guy that did it. But I, I foolishly didn't realize until after he was gone that he had got my wallet. Because when I was stepping into the van, he was up close. And I turned and kind of looked at him like, you Finn to catch these hands, <laugh> . And he immediately saw, and this , this is how bad it was, y'all. He saw that I was actually carrying, I had like a <laugh> , this is gonna sound so bad. I had a devotional. <laugh>. Oh Lord. I had a Bible devotional. I ,

Andre: 55:04

Wait, wait , you took your Bible to your No , just , no , you just leave it there. <laugh> . Just leave it there a minute . Your

Anitra: 55:11

Game on how people boot . I didn't say it was a booty call. It was not a booty

Andre: 55:16

Call. You didn't have to say , it was not to say , lemme

Anitra: 55:19

Be clear, it was not. None of that. None of that stuff was

Andre: 55:22

Going down . Don't buy, you don't even buy tickets from cheap tickets . Call for a Bible study, whatever.

Anitra: 55:29

I'm telling y'all , I was not that. Don't you believe my brother? But here's how this guy got me y'all. Because he was too close to me. And I looked at him and I, you know, my brother taught me like I was about to give, you know, put some hands on him. And he goes, oh, is that a devotional? And me and my foolish, you know,

Andre: 55:45

Naive

Anitra: 55:45

Self .

Andre: 55:45

I was like, yes, it's , and so

Anitra: 55:48

We're riding in the

Andre: 55:49

Show . The devil knows Shutt . Read that devotion though .

Anitra: 55:52

My wallet ,

Andre: 55:54

Wallet . He , he could have done that all day. He know You didn't open that. You didn't crack that bible open. I didn't crack it . Yeah . That's , I want , listen,

Anitra: 56:02

I want the record to reflect. None of those trips were inappropriate in that the way my brothers tried to apply. But anyway ,

Andre: 56:10

The Lord

Anitra: 56:11

Story , the Lord knows Jesus knows.

Andre: 56:14

Oh , oh , he knows . He heard you <laugh> . He heard your fry <laugh> . So,

Anitra: 56:22

So this man had my wallet. I didn't know. 'cause we pull up to the parking garage, everybody goes their separate ways. I get into my car, I've got my ticket, and I'm like, where is my wallet? Long story short, I had to call my homegirl and was like, you're gonna have to come and bring me. And they, you know, they charge you the max at that time , that time, you know , life , you had to pay the fool for the day rate or whatever. If you couldn't find your ticket, they maximize it. 'cause it's your fault that you, you know, lost your wallet, whatever. So it's like 1130 at night on a Sunday. 'cause I'm coming back on the weekend. So I'm pulling her outta her bed. <laugh> , she's driving now to the airport shuttle place to pick me up and to pay <laugh> and to pay for my ticket. Said that I gotta get my stuff together. And so as she's, you know, I get in my car and she stops and she hugs me and she says, Anitra, <laugh> , move forward. God forgives you. No, she didn't do any of that. She's not judgmental like my brother. She says, moving forward, she said, let's just agree that when you're gonna go to the airport, we're gonna plan it in advance, <laugh> . And we're gonna , I'm gonna drop you off. Like basically saying, in your kind of protection of your independence, you have shown your vulnerability. Right? <laugh> , it's your need . Right? Oh God , God . Instead of just purely dealing with it straight up, instead of just saying, Hey, I'm going on a trip. This is where I'm gonna be. Can you help me out? Can you drive? Can you drop me off? And that becomes, again, that's why it's a versus syndrome, right? We get to these spaces where sometimes we're like, I don't want to invite people into my space because then I have to, what? I have to show them my vulnerability, show them my need. I'm protecting my independence. And here's the thing, when you do that, you get exposed anyway, because I was Right. <laugh> , you get exposed anyway. And now you also have to balance it out. Because I obviously wanted to pay her back. She wasn't requiring that. Ooh , thank God . But I had to do quite a bit to kind of, and she's, that's the beauty of good friends. And so it even brings me to another really short story, but all about my independence, you know, and my freedom versus the need. When I first had , you know, when, when Ralph and I, my ex-husband, we first had our son Malachi, we were living in a bachelorette apartment in Inglewood. And if you guys don't know Bachelorettes are , uh, smaller than studios. Yeah. I remember . Don't even have remember . I remember it . Yeah. They don't even have kitchenettes. They, they just have like the rest the bathroom with the, you know, the tub and all that stuff. Little side , little sink area. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> . And so they're really made obviously not for, for families or at least it can be a little bit more of a struggle to make a family work in there. And bro , I kid you not that for , so I had Kai , I was on maternity leave before I went back to my job. And for months, all the people at my job , uh, family, friends were all reaching out like, Hey, can we come by for a visit? You know, we got stuff for your son and we can't wait to, and I would just shun them all. Yeah. I just say no, because I was ashamed of our living situation. Right . And I was ashamed of what we had financially. And I remember once I got back to work and as I started getting back out talking to people, they all would just gimme the gifts that they had collected for months. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , some of the stuff Kai could no longer even fit at that point. He had already <laugh> . They were like, has he graduated from college at this point? Like, you know, like, what's going on? Right. And it was because of my own , uh, you know, just foolish shame where people who want to have relationships with you, they're, they're trying to be , uh, the answer. They're trying to be a need. They're trying to fill needs in you or trying to help you through that process. And they don't have judgment. They don't come with that space of, oh, I'm gonna judge what you are. They'll take your embarrassment, your shame and say here. And that's the thing that my mom, our mom said to us, she was just like, Anitra or Nikki , she's like, Nikki , it's, they don't care about that. What they're saying is, we wanna share right in the joy of this new, you know, this new development in your life, we wanna, and , and if nothing else, and she told me this too, sometimes when they see your circumstance mm-hmm. <affirmative> , they're gonna start filling in the needs based on what they see . See based on that . Yep . But if you're not allowing them to see it, then you know, there's a , you're not allowing that space to come to where they can step in. So I'll just, I'll say this and I'll kick it back to you when it comes to that versus syndrome. Both can be good. Mm-hmm . <affirmative> , it's okay. When you need to protect your independence. It's okay when you need to show your vulnerability, but when you view the need to be needed as pressure mm-hmm . <affirmative> , then you block your ability to be a blessing, your ability to be a blessing to someone else. And when you shun someone else's desire to be your solution or support to your need, you block your own blessing. Yeah. Yeah . From coming in. And so get rid of the vers syndrome and know that both can be good and find that harmony, you know, for that. So I'll kick it back to you, brother . So , so is it a get rid of the vers or balance the vers syndrome balance? That's probably better. Yeah . Balance it.